DSL on IBM thin client?

Forum: Other Help Topics
Topic: DSL on IBM thin client?
started by: mike85gn

Posted by mike85gn on Nov. 04 2004,00:23

So I have a good working IBM NetVista thin client PC here. It's been pretty much useless for the past few years, it has been retired from its previous role. This device has no hard disk, but it has a built-in Compact Flash card slot for storage, 64mb RAM, 233mhz x86 processor, 2 USB 1.1 ports, unknown video, and what appears to be an SIS chipset.

Has anyone tried something like this before? The thin PC is designed to boot from the CF card to access network resources, it should be possible to have it boot to Linux as well.

Is there a list of supported hardware somewhere?

I have pictures, but am unable to host them, message me for details if you'd like!

Posted by davide on Nov. 04 2004,12:01

it must be possibile.
search the forum as for dsl and flash cards.
also there are plenty of methods for booting from network (also an option is booting from a usb stick if your pc has a usb plug) previously discussed in the forum. can't help yo ucause i'm not a geek, but I know it's possibile to do that painlessly.

:;):

Posted by caulktel on Nov. 04 2004,16:23

Hi,

I must have the same Netvista as you do,mine is a N2200 8363, and I tried everyway I know to get it to boot from compact flash with no success. It would be so cool to have one of these running DSL, but it only wants to boot from the network, and I could not get the proper server running on the network to pull it off. The conclusion I came to is that a person would have to write a differant bios for these machines to get them to directly boot from compact flash, and that would be so cool because they have all the processor power and video to work very well with DSL, and they are so small. Here is a link to IBM's site:
< http://www-1.ibm.com/support....c=en_US >

Hope that helps.

Posted by AwPhuch on Nov. 04 2004,18:25

Would this help you guys out?

< http://www-1.ibm.com/support....c=en_US >

Quote

Boot from Flash
Click the Boot from Flash icon to change a workstation or workstation group
resource’s settings so that it boots from CompactFlash. Refer to the product help
for more details about this operation.
For Turbolinux 7 thin clients, use the “Setup Network Connections” on page 19
icon to configure workstations to boot from the CompactFlash card.

< http://www-1.ibm.com/support....c=en_US >

Brian
AwPhuch

Posted by SaidinUnleashed on Nov. 04 2004,18:26

or you could just do a frugal install to a CF card and run it off of that.

-J.P.

Posted by caulktel on Nov. 04 2004,21:05

Thanks for all the info, but I have already looked at all this stuff from IBM, and I still don't know how to do it. I did a frugal install to the CF card and made sure it would boot ok, then plugged it into the netvista machine, but could not figure out how to boot it. It kept tring to boot to a server somewhere on the network even though it showed that the compact card was plugged in. After it tried every boot methed it could and then would error out and say it could not boot. It would be so cool to get it to boot, but I'm not sure how.

Posted by AwPhuch on Nov. 04 2004,22:50

Can you tell it to network boot from the loopback IP 127.0.0.1?

Brian
AwPhuch

Posted by SaidinUnleashed on Nov. 05 2004,00:17

does it have a floppy? if so, try the boot floppy!

Posted by caulktel on Nov. 05 2004,00:40

Saidin,

There is no floppy drive, this thing is about the size of a medium sized book. I looked for some more information today, and found this:
< http://csgrad74.math.uwaterloo.ca/~cdmica....TO.html >

Everybody says that this thing will boot from compact flash, but I have yet to find out how to do it as all the options seem to be network boot. I'm going to try to find a picture of it to show everybody. it's cool.

Posted by mike85gn on Nov. 05 2004,02:02

Here are some pics on this baby, there are quite a few for sale on E-bay at any given time.

< http://i8.ebayimg.com/02/i/02/c0/43/83_3.JPG >
< http://i3.ebayimg.com/02/i/02/c0/0a/9d_3.JPG >
< http://i5.ebayimg.com/01/i/02/c0/1a/16_3.JPG >

The model on mine is 8363-EXX. What I'd really like to do is use it as a secure Linux terminal for all my online banking, e-baying, and other such transactions, a friend just fell victim to identity theft and found several accounts seriously short of cash, now there's a criminal investigation... MS doesn't really inspire any confidence in me security-wise anymore...

Posted by AwPhuch on Nov. 05 2004,17:42

Can you get to the BIOS?

At boot (the manual says to hit ESC)

Try to get in the BIOS and look around...perhaps you can tell it to either do a boot from localhost, 127.0.0.1, or tell it to boot from the CFDISK

Brian
AwPhuch

Posted by caulktel on Nov. 05 2004,19:10

Brian,

Yes I can get to the bios, but there is no actual referance to booting directly from CF, so they may just be saying it a differant way. I'm curios though, how does this loopback thing work, would I need to install to the CF a special way or just standard Frugal install? I need to round up a USB keyboard so I can play with it again, I barrowed one from a friend last time. I will pick one up today and get into the bios on the Netvista then post back the choices.

Posted by caulktel on Nov. 06 2004,20:52

Well, I picked up a USB keyboard today and tried differant ways to boot this thing, but still cannot seem to figure out how. There is a bazillon ways (that's a lot), to get this thing to boot across a network. Can anyone explain how the loopback address works? Maybe that's the key. I would love to use this as my Shoutcast music server.

Posted by Pengel on Dec. 30 2004,21:09

This is the sum total of my knowledge on the IBM 2800 series NetVista Model 8364-TUS thin clients:

Series Netvista N2800e
Model 8364-TUS

Processor: Pentium MMX 266
Bus Speed: 66 MHz
Video: S3 Trio 4MB
Sound: Crystal CS423x

External Connectors:

rear:

2 USB 1.1
2 serial RS232
1 parallel
1 VGA
1 PS/2 mouse
1 keyboard
1 RJ45 16/4
1 ISO line cord connector
1 hardware power switch
front:

1 stereo headphone jack
1 microphone jack
1 soft power switch

Internal connectors:

1 disk drive power connnector - takes a Molex 4305-400 connector; not sure of pin out
1 wake on LAN
2 PCI
1 aux audio in
1 CF slot - becomes ide0 (/dev/hda) if CF is installed
1 IDE channel - for a hard drive; if the CF is installed, it will be be ide1 (/dev/hdb);
if no CF is installed, 2 IDE devices may be connected
1 VIP connector
1 PASSWOD OVRD jumper
1 BOOTBLK jumper

List of IBM thin client publications
< http://publib.boulder.ibm.com/netcom/html/pub.htm >

2800 manual in English (pdf)
< http://publib.boulder.ibm.com/netcom/pdfs/qb3a9y00.pdf >

< http://www.freegeekmichiana.org/netvista.html >

Mother Board Connectors
The one labeled BOOTBLK allows you to recover the bootblock image (bios) (see Appendix D. Recovering the boot block image in the 2800 reference manual), the PASSWOD OVRD resets the bios and allows access to the thin client setup utility. Both of these should be in the position furthest away from the front panel. The WAKE connector I believe is wake on modem or lan. There is also a connector for aux audio in (from a cd drive maybe). The VIP Connector (Video Input Port) is for things like TV tuners, HDTV (high definition TV) cards, etc. VIP is an industry standard connector port. The 4 pin connector near the ide connector is power for a hard drive (not sure of the pinout but the mating connector is a Molex 43025-0400)

To Reset the password and BIOS
1. Turn off and unplug the 2800, network too
2. Move the jumper on the jumper block closest to the power switch on the
front labeled PASSWOD OVRD, or something close, to the position closest to the front panel
3. Plug it and start the system wait about 20 sec and shutdown
4. Unplug the system and move the jumper back.
5. Boot the system with the network unplugged. When the system cannot
connect to the network select Workspace on Demand from the choices offered. The system should leave
you in the BIOS setup, if not, reboot and press F2 when prompted for the BIOS Setup.

To Set The BIOS to boot from the CF

I have used the following to set the BIOS parameters:
1. Reset BIOS defaults
2. Change the following:
a. Devices and I/O -> Network Setup -> Network Support = Disabled
(if you are using the onboard NIC)
b. Start Options -> Startup Sequence -> Primary Startup Sequence =>
First Startup Device = Hard Disk 0
c. Start Options -> Firmware Selection = Workspace on Demand
(very important, otherwise the 2800 will not attempt to boot from
the CF
d. Start Options -> Power-On Self Test = Quick
(Optional - speeds boot time but skips some memory testing)
e. Advanced Setup -> PCI Control -> Network Adapters = Enabled
3. Save Settings (Will also reboot system)

Pengel

Posted by COST Linux on Jan. 14 2005,22:40

I've done it. I've hacked this thing a while ago while on a quest of building my own cheap Linux firewall. I developed my own tiny Linux distro I called COST (Cheap-Off-The-Shelf) Linux. I've hacked several tin clients and the Netvista N2200 was probably the most challenging.

Besides the Token ring and Ethernet version, the N2200 comes in a Linux and Windows version. The difference is the IBM's proprietary BIOS. If you have the Windows version, you can convert it by re-flashing the BIOS.

Once you have the Linux booting BIOS, you'll need to configure it to boot from the CF if network failed. Then let it boot. When the network failed, it'll look for a kernel with a file named kernel.2x00 on your disk's first partition i.e. /dev/hda1. That's the secret! Another secret is that this is not your ordinary kernel that runs on your desktop, which is a compressed kernel. The N2200 only boots from an uncompressed kernel (probably does not have the uncompress utility in the BIOS). It should be the vmlinux file under your kernel source directory. All you have to do is copy it to your CF and rename it kernel.2x00.

Once the system boots your kernel, you practically have control over it. How you run your system from here on is up to you. For my COST Linux, I had to some plumbing to create a file system in RAM, chroot, etc. in order to have an embedded OS running in memory. If you'd like to know more about COST, I hope I can publish it soon.

I have a couple of these at home. Got them from ebay for $10 and $25 respectively. One is my home Linux FW (which I can ssh into) and the other backs it up. Very nice system.

Posted by caulktel on Jan. 15 2005,02:44

Yes, I am very interested in exactly how you did this. I was on the right track, because I also figured out that it had to have the kernel.2x00 name, and I tried that only I didn't know that it had to be an uncompressed kernel (it actually started to load, then said something about wrong file type). I am not sure whether that kernel exists in DSL.
anyway if you could shed a little more light I would be greatfull as I have been working on this for quite some time now. I have the 22ooL version that booted Turbo linux, 8363 TUS.

Posted by cbagger01 on Jan. 15 2005,20:39

I wonder if a solution is a simple as unzipping the existing kernel file in DSL?

I don't know a lot about kernel compression formats, but maybe you can do a

gunzip linux24

and get an uncompressed kernel.

Posted by SaidinUnleashed on Jan. 16 2005,01:37

Actually, the kernel image is bz2'd i think.

Posted by cbagger01 on Jan. 16 2005,06:23

So then:

bunzip2 linux24
mv linux24.out vmlinux

or:

bzip2 -d linux24
mv linux24.out vmlinux

should work, no?

Posted by caulktel on Jan. 16 2005,16:19

CB, I will give this a try as soon as I get some time. Thanks for the idea.

Posted by caulktel on Jan. 17 2005,00:22

Well, no luck on unziping the kernel. When I bunzip it, it says it's not a bzip file, and I tried all the others with no success. What I would need to do is build me a new kernel, then compile it, and save it as uncompressed. I have built many custom kernels before, but I'm not sure I want to start from scratch and I don't know where to get the config file for this kernel, unless it's the same one on the knoppix cd (if there is one on the knoppix cd). Well at least I think that now i'm on the right track. Maybe John or Robert has a uncommpressed kernel laying around.

Posted by tackettb on Jan. 17 2005,02:20

wow this looks promising. I have one of these, it boots fine off of the 16mb cf card that it came with but I have been unable to get it to boot from anything else. I haven't compiled a custom kernel but I'm very interested in what comes of this.

Posted by N2200 on Jan. 17 2005,15:02

You can't just unzip the bzImage kernel. You'll have to compile your own kernel with make vmlinux instead of make bzImage.

It's not a good idea to run your Linux off of the CF because it'll wear out quick. I had to do some tricks to create a RAM filesystem, mount it, then chroot to it. All of my hack was designed to run my COST Linux. I'm not familiar with DSL in order to tell you how.

Posted by 8363 on Jan. 23 2005,19:12

Take a look at < http://mitglied.lycos.de/aitaits/2200linux/ > .
I tryed to make a Debian based Linux for the Netvista 2200 (8363) Thin Client.
It is an experimental one and may include some errors, but on my Netvista 2200
it works.Included are Xmms, Dillo, Netkit-ftp, Gqcam, Gqviev, Lynx and a unconfigurated Fluxbox.
It starts with XF86 and Rxvt-xterm. To use the applications you must start them from
command-line.

Posted by caulktel on Jan. 24 2005,00:55

8363,

Thanks. Xmms is all I want to run anyway, so I will give it a try and see what happens.

Posted by caulktel on Jan. 24 2005,17:24

8363,

Well, I tried it, and was very excited until it got to the error:
"Kernel panic: no init found. Try passing init=option to kernel."
I reformatted the cf card and tried it a second time, but had the same results. Wow! this is as close as I have ever been to getting this thing to boot. Got any ideas? Please.

Posted by caulktel on Jan. 24 2005,17:26

I got to thinking that perhaps I could get DSL to boot using 8363's kernel. Anybody think so?

Posted by SaidinUnleashed on Jan. 24 2005,18:49

Perhaps the syslinux that frugal is using does not have drivers for the cf reader.

Maybe it's on top of a usb bus?

Have you tried using the usb boot floppy's syslinux?

Just firing out in the dark, i really have no clue.

-J.P.

Posted by caulktel on Jan. 24 2005,19:12

JP,

Thanks for the post, but really all I need to make this boot DSL is a uncomressed kernel image. 8363's kernel booted just fine it just couldn't find the init file to continue the boot up. I'm hoping he comes back to the forum and sheds a little more light on the subject, because I would really like to get this thing running DSL preferably, but would take any Linux distro now.

Posted by 8363 on Jan. 24 2005,20:09

caulktel,

normally the kernel is saerching for "init". Init is a function of bin/busybox. There must a link from inti to busybox.
ls -l /bin/init must give bin/init -> busybox .
Init (busybox) now is looking for "etc/init.d/rcS" and runs it.
look on your CF-Card if the files "bin/busybox" /bin/init" (as link) and
"etc/init.d/rcS" are there.
Another idea is: did you update the clients firmware ?
Maybe the firmware is looking in a wrong directory.
For updating the firmware look here:
< http://csgrad74.math.uwaterloo.ca/~cdmica....TO.html >
I update the firmware before i started me tryings.

Posted by 8363 on Jan. 24 2005,20:17

caulktel,

to update the firmware i copied the bflash.2200 file into the root
directory of the CF-Card. The client uses (finds) the file automatically.

Posted by caulktel on Jan. 24 2005,20:48

8363,

I already flashed the firmware using bflash.2200. I am currently running
7/29/02 firmware. I will download your package again and try it again. It was really cool to see it almost work. If it works for you it should work for me too.

Posted by 8363 on Jan. 24 2005,20:49

SaidinUnleashed

the firmware of the Netvista boots the kernel without using a boot-loader like syslinux, lilo or grub

Posted by cbagger01 on Jan. 25 2005,06:09

Your kernel is probably confused.

It is trying to find an init in the root filesystem, but it cannot.

Maybe it cannot even find the root filesystem iteself?

Is there a specific format / filename needed for the root filesystem for the 2200's bootloader?

Maybe you need a minirt.gz but with a different name.

Posted by 8363 on Jan. 25 2005,08:38

cbagger01, caulktel

i try to find the reason why it don't work.
I downloaded the file myself and untar it.
after cp -a to the CF-Card i find out all links have not beeing copied to
the card. For example: /bin/init -> busybox is missing.

I yet don't know the reason, i'm working on it.

Posted by 8363 on Jan. 25 2005,11:16

cbagger01, caulktel

it depends on the CF-Card. I have two 64MB CF-Card and treated them in the same way (cfdisk,
mhe2fs). On one card i could copy all files and links, on the other card i could only copy the files not the links.

Posted by caulktel on Jan. 25 2005,17:09

8363,

For what it's worth I am using a SanDisk 256 meg CF card. After two tries I get the same results, and yes you are right, it's not copying the links. I am going to try it again from a DSL hard drive installation. I think it has to do with the system you are tring to copy it from more that it has to do with the CF card.

Posted by 8363 on Jan. 25 2005,17:47

caulktel,
my system is Debian Woody.
I'm trying both cards on the same system. One was OK and the other don't copy the links.
After playing around with cfdisk and mke2fs ( about a thousand times) the second card works to. But i really dont Know why, because i tried it so often and suddenly it works.
Allthough both cards are 64MB, cfdisk shows different heads, sectors and cylinders, but i don't think thats not the reason.

I use a 128MB and a 256MB Card too, they all worked well with my files. On both of the cards
i made two partitions (68/60MB and 128/128MB) and use only the first one for the 2200linux.

Posted by caulktel on Jan. 25 2005,18:00

8363,

I got it to work by using DSL. Last two times I tried it I was using Yoper Linux, so I'm not sure what the answer is. Anyway, now I have something to work with. Have you given any thought to trying to this with DSL? It also is Debian based(well Knoppix based). Another ?, what keyboard map are you using on yours? I had to hunt and peck looking for the slash key, which i found as shift 7. I did start Fluxbox, but it will take a little configuration to use it. But, Im just thrilled to have it boot. Thank You. I wonder if your kernel would boot DSL, because it auto detects everything on boot up, I think it would be easier.

Posted by 8363 on Jan. 25 2005,18:10

caulktel
it loaded the german keymap. Look at /etc/init.d/rcS and delete or comment out the line
"loadkmap < /key.map" . Then it should use the english keyboard.

Posted by 8363 on Jan. 25 2005,18:26

caulktel

>Have you given any thought to trying to this with DSL?<

Not really.I tried it, but i gave up very early.
Because DSL uses miniroot.gz. Using miniroot you have to tell the kernel about it.
But it don't work, because the you must use kernel options to tell the kernel about it, the Netvista firmware didn#t allow it.

By the way, i have a Netvista 2800 (8364) too, DSL works fine on it.

Posted by clivesay on Jan. 25 2005,18:27

Quote (caulktel @ Jan. 25 2005,12:00)

I got it to work by using DSL. Last two times I tried it I was using Yoper Linux, so I'm not sure what the answer is. Anyway, now I have something to work with. Have you given any thought to trying to this with DSL? It also is Debian based(well Knoppix based). Another ?, what keyboard map are you using on yours? I had to hunt and peck looking for the slash key, which i found as shift 7. I did start Fluxbox, but it will take a little configuration to use it. But, Im just thrilled to have it boot. Thank You. I wonder if your kernel would boot DSL, because it auto detects everything on boot up, I think it would be easier.

Caulktel - This is great news! What a journey this has been for you!

Congrats,

Chris

Posted by caulktel on Jan. 25 2005,18:37

Thanks Chris, it has been quite a process. Now to get the sound working. I loaded some Shoutcast .pls files onto the CF card in the home directory and fired up Xmms only to find the sound is not working.

8363, did sound work for you? And thanks for the tip on the keymap.

Posted by SaidinUnleashed on Jan. 25 2005,18:46

Can we get some shots of this baby in action?

I always like to se people's new DSL toys.

-J.P.

Posted by 8363 on Jan. 25 2005,19:22

Quote (caulktel @ Jan. 25 2005,13:37)

i included the libraries for mpeg and wav .
I don't know what pls files are, but i go to www.shoutcast.com (with my
Desktop PC) and look for the IP of the CLUB 977 The 80s Channel
(http://64.236.34.97:80/stream/1040) , then put this IP
on "play location" on the Netvistas Xmms and it works.
wav and mpegfiles on the cf-card are working to.
Maybe there is a library for pls files, but i don't put it on the system.

Posted by 8363 on Jan. 25 2005,19:47

caulktel,

now i know what a pls file is. It is only a text-file like this:

[playlist]
File1=http://rs4.radiostreamer.com:11000
Title1=DRS 2006 Radio Network
Length1=-1
File2=http://rs2.radiostreamer.com:10000
Title2=DRS 2006 Radio Network
Length2=-1
NumberOfEntries=2
Version=2

It tells Xmms the IP of the Musik-channel.

I try it , yes it works, but the Netvista need to be connected to the Internet.
You can configure it ( the ip of the Thin client,gateway and dns server) by press the ESC button before the firmware started the kernel or
you can use ifconfig and route. Using ifconfig and root needs a bit of "handwork".
It is easier to use the Clients Configuration.

Posted by caulktel on Jan. 25 2005,20:08

8363,

pls files are what shoutcast uses. If you go to shoutcast.com and pick the station of choice, when you click the "tune in" button to the left it loads a shoutcast.pls file to your hard drive or if you so specify starts your favorite music client. If you look in the .pls file you will find info like you were talking about, like the ip address of the stream. Normally, I just save the link to my home directory, then start Xmms up and go to open file, then choose that shoutcast.pls file, then hit play.

It is in fact connecting to the stream, but gives me the found no sound card error.

Posted by caulktel on Jan. 25 2005,20:10

8363,

I have mine configured for dhcp, so Im already connected to the internet, infact I have been surfing the web in Dillo.

Posted by 8363 on Jan. 25 2005,20:21

caulktel ,

you are right, the version i put to the internet has an error. I tried it with
an other version. I'm working on it

Posted by 8363 on Jan. 25 2005,20:47

caulktel ,

go to xmms -> option ->preferences ->audio io/plugins -> output plugin ->
configure -> klick on "use alternative device" and change "dev/dsp or whatever " to /dev/sound/audio".

Posted by 8363 on Jan. 25 2005,21:06

caulktel,

to save it make "cp -a .xmms hda"

good night

Posted by Mike on Jan. 25 2005,21:28

Hello,

I've been watching and am very interested in this hack.

The only thing I wnat to know is, is the Flash drive set to read only beacuse on other fourms they said it can wear them out.

thanks.

Posted by caulktel on Jan. 25 2005,21:29

Hey 8363,

That did the trick. I now have streaming audio playing in my shop. One more thing, how would you go about changing the screen res. down to 800x600? Should I just edit the xf86config file, if so which line?

Posted by caulktel on Jan. 26 2005,00:08

Mike,

I'm not sure about the answer here. 8363 put this together from a Debian Woody install, so I'm not sure how he is doing it without looking a little closer. Most apps run in memory, so I don't think it would be a problem, but without a hard drive activity light on the netvista it is kind of hard to see if the OS is thrashing the CF or not. That is why I really wanted to use DSL installed as Frugal, as the whole file system and all apps would have been running in ram. I don't think it is as critical anymore with the newer CF cards anyway.

Posted by 8363 on Jan. 26 2005,07:21

Mike,

CF-Cards only wearing out by writing. So i use a ramdisk and copy some
directories into it, some other directories (they are only been read ) i linked to the
ramdisk. Then i "chroot" into the ramdisk, now the ramdisk is the root system.

To make it safer, you may uncomment the line
"#umount / "
in the file "ram".
When you uncomment it, the CF_Card is readonly mounted.

Posted by 8363 on Jan. 26 2005,07:22

caulktel,

>how would you go about changing the screen res. down to 800x600? <
>Should I just edit the xf86config file,<

yes
> if so which line?<

change in /etc/XF86Config

------------------------------------------
Section "Screen"
Driver "svga"
Device "MediaGX"
Monitor "Monitor0"
Subsection "Display"
#Depth 8
Depth 16
Modes "1024x768"
#Modes "800x600"
#Modes "640x480"
EndSubsection
EndSection
-------------------------------------------------

into

------------------------------------------
Section "Screen"
Driver "svga"
Device "MediaGX"
Monitor "Monitor0"
Subsection "Display"
#Depth 8
Depth 16
#Modes "1024x768"
Modes "800x600"
#Modes "640x480"
EndSubsection
EndSection
-------------------------------------------------

Posted by Thin_Client_Newbie on Jan. 26 2005,19:55

I dont believe it!!!! I have been looking for help on this ever since i bought this doorstop off ebay. I wanted to experiment with thin clients, didnt know what to buy so bought the cheapest thing off ebay, an IBM Netvista N220 EXX, but booted it up to find it would only PXE off server, which I had yet and have yet to learn how to use properly. Anyway, i read and read and realised i needed a CF card and some software, but after weeks of fruitless trying I give up, until today I find this page and someone has plugged a CF card in with a mini OS on it and can access shoutcast...WOW!!!

I run windows XP SP2, I also have Windows Server 2003. I have experiment with Linspire and Suse9 distros of linux and I find them very difficult to configure and work with, yes linux runs swell, but if it went wrong i wouldnt have a clue what to do. Anyway back to my point, could someone let me know if there is a way of getting a CF card running like 8363 and Caulktel without haveing linux. Could someone provide me with an image that i could put onto a blank CF disc? or some other way of replicating what they did but in a windows environment. All i require from the thin client is to play music streams, and also experiment with linux

Posted by 8363 on Jan. 27 2005,08:18

Thin_Client_Newbie

i don't know much about windows. To make the CF-Card bootable , windows must be able to create a ext2 filesystem. I made an image of the CF-Card, but i yet don't have enough webspace to host it.

Posted by 8363 on Jan. 27 2005,08:29

Thin_Client_Newbie

to experiment with linux try Damnsmalllinux

Quote

Damn Small Linux is a business card size (50MB) bootable Live CD Linux

or Knoppix

Posted by tackettb on Jan. 27 2005,21:00

Wow this is great! I got mine running. How hard is it to install additional apps to this?

Posted by 8363 on Jan. 28 2005,07:26

Quote (tackettb @ Jan. 27 2005,16:00)

Wow this is great! I got mine running. How hard is it to install additional apps to this?

You must have a Debian Woddy Linux. First look where the app (for example:Nedit) you needed is:

$ whereis nedit
nedit: /usr/X11R6/bin/nedit

copy nedit to your card

cp /usr/X11R6/bin/nedit /yourcard/usr/X11R6/bin

look which libraries needed by Nedit

$ ldd /usr/X11R6/bin/nedit
libXm.so.1 => /usr/lib/libXm.so.1 (0x40021000)
libXpm.so.4 => /usr/X11R6/lib/libXpm.so.4 (0x4014b000)
libXext.so.6 => /usr/X11R6/lib/libXext.so.6 (0x4015a000)
libXt.so.6 => /usr/X11R6/lib/libXt.so.6 (0x40167000)
libSM.so.6 => /usr/X11R6/lib/libSM.so.6 (0x401b1000)
libICE.so.6 => /usr/X11R6/lib/libICE.so.6 (0x401b9000)
libX11.so.6 => /usr/X11R6/lib/libX11.so.6 (0x401cf000)
libm.so.6 => /lib/libm.so.6 (0x402a9000)
libc.so.6 => /lib/libc.so.6 (0x402ca000)
/lib/ld-linux.so.2 => /lib/ld-linux.so.2 (0x40000000)

look if the libaries are on your card, otherwise copy the
missing libraries to yourcard. Make sure the libary isn't a link.

example:/usr/X11R6/lib/libXt.so.6

ls -l /usr/X11R6/lib/libXt.so.6
lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 12 4. Apr 2004 /usr/X11R6/lib/libXt.so.6 -> libXt.so.6.0

you see /usr/X11R6/lib/libXt.so.6 is linked to libXt.so.6.0

to copy both (the lib and the link) make

cp -a /usr/X11R6/lib/libXt.so* /yourcard/usr/X11R6/lib

In this case (nedit) thats all.
Some apps needed more files (configuration files, etc) or depend on other apps, then you have to look into the docs,to
google or to find it out by "try and error".

Posted by Itheemonk on Jan. 28 2005,07:51

Hi, i know this isn't the right place to be asking this question but i don't know where else i can. I have an n2200 and all i want to do (for now) is get it to boot from my network. I have win2k advanced server and ibm v2r1, what else do i need?

Posted by TubbyTommy on Jan. 28 2005,13:43

Hey 8363!

Well done for all the most useful posts to this forum - your enlightenment is much appreciated, and much kudos to you.

I have a question. I have extracted a VMLINUZ and an INITRD from an installer CDROM. I'd like to use the INITRD with a compiled version of DSL kernel VMLINUX to boot the N2200 then install the rest of the package over the net.

Is this possible, do you think?

Thanks in advance!

TubbyT

Posted by 8363 on Jan. 28 2005,15:03

Quote (TubbyTommy @ Jan. 28 2005,08:43)

I have a question. I have extracted a VMLINUZ and an INITRD from an installer CDROM. I'd like to use the INITRD with a compiled version of DSL kernel VMLINUX to boot the N2200 then install the rest of the package over the net.

Is this possible, do you think?

TT,

no, i think it is not possible, because the ibm firmware
bootloader dont tell the kernel to use initrd.

Posted by TubbyTommy on Feb. 03 2005,20:14

Quote (8363 @ Jan. 28 2005,10:03)

Quote (TubbyTommy @ Jan. 28 2005,08:43)

TT,

no, i think it is not possible, because the ibm firmware
bootloader dont tell the kernel to use initrd.

Any chance you could post a detailed guide for us beginners, please 8363?

I've downloaded your image from Lycos.de, and managed to get it to boot over NFS. However, I'd really, *really* like to follow your instructions step-by-step and learn how to compile and build a kernel for the N2200 8363. Then I'd be able to keep practising and hopefully get to grips with it.

Thanks for your postings anyway.

TT.

Posted by Thin_Client_Newbie on Feb. 06 2005,20:47

Hi, I have recently since my last post managed to install and run K12LTSP and would like to update the firmaware on my CF-less and Diskless IBM N2200 thin client (off ebay) so that it can boot from LTSP, I have managed on all clients but this darn one, How can I update the BIOS to boot from LTSP. I have the flash file, but how do I apply it, I heard I can copy it to a CF card and boot it from cf? this sounds too simple, anyone help me please?

Posted by tackettb on Feb. 07 2005,00:03

Just copy the flash file to the root directory of the cf and the netvista will auto detect it, worked great for me.

Posted by 8363 on Feb. 07 2005,20:12

Quote (TubbyTommy @ Feb. 03 2005,15:14)

Any chance you could post a detailed guide for us beginners, please 8363?

TT.

TT

I don't know now. Maybe some times.
If i decide to wrote an instruction, i will put in on:

< http://www.mitglied.lycos.de/aitaits/2200linux/ >

Some important sites are:
< http://csgrad74.math.uwaterloo.ca/~cdmica....TO.html >
from this site i use :
Required kernel patches for kernel 2.4.21,
Kernel configuration for patched kernel 2.4.21,
IBM's patched XF86_SVGA server 3.x,
The XFree86 3.3.6 configuration file,
Firmware update to 07/29/02 for NetVista 2200

the kernel source from:
< http://www.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/v2.4/linux-2.4.21.tar.gz >

on:
< http://www.digitalhermit.com/linux....ION-2-4 >
you could read how to build a kernel

8363

Posted by Gav on Feb. 08 2005,00:15

Hey, that's Really useful!
I bought my n2200 two days ago (ebay!), only just got round to pluging it in.
Now it boots linux not ce & the bios is upgraded!
Thanks for the help - hope I can add something useful soon, I want to get this n2200 working as a jukebox (nice & quiet).
-gav.

Posted by tackettb on Feb. 08 2005,15:22

Has anyone used a larger than 256mb cf on this? 256mb is as high as they go in the ibm documentation.
Also has anyone gotten any new apps to run? I attempted to run Teamspeak server, but it just starts then I get kernel panic and dumps to console then requires a restart.

Posted by cmilte on Feb. 10 2005,22:59

Quote (tackettb @ Feb. 08 2005,10:22)

I mine off ebay last week for $9.99 + $15S&H after losing another auction for one with the keyboard and mouse for $61.

Anyhow...I installed a 512MB CF card I picked up from OfficeMax last week and it is detected correctly by the bios.

Has anyone been able to get a USB wifi adapter to work? What about a USB external hard drive? I'd want to listen to shoutcast stations out in my workshop and play mp3/ogg files from the external hard drive, but I'd like to avoid running cat5 across the back yard (very low acceptance level by the old lady).

Thanks,
Chris

Posted by 8363 on Feb. 11 2005,08:19

The site with the linux for netvista 2200
< http://www.mitglied.lycos.de/aitaits/2200linux/ >
is down.
The provider closed it because of to much traffic (and/or to big files).
Any idea where i can host the linux for netvista 2200.

Posted by apeman on Feb. 11 2005,18:22

8363, I can host the files for you. email me at: apemanspaceman@gmail.com and I can put the files up under my site for you.

Posted by cbagger01 on Feb. 11 2005,23:35

If you can't get a WIFI adapter to work with your thin client, an alternative might be to set up a wireless bridge. If you already own the router/AP, you can buy a bridge or "gaming adapter" and then connect it up to the wired LAN port on your thin client. The thin client will think that it is connected to a wired network instead of a wireless network.

Otherwise, you could purchase two LinkSYS WRT54g routers and install sveasoft custom firmware that allows you to use the 2nd router as a wireless bridge in "WDS mode".

Posted by cmilte on Feb. 12 2005,00:56

I'm trying to keep this project as inexpensive as possible, so purchasing a wireless bridge is out. I have an old laptop I can set up as a wireless bridge (maybe even as an access point) if I can find a 16-bit PCMCIA wireless adapter it will recognize. Yeah...it's an old laptop!

I've got a CF card reader on order but I wanted to try flashing the bios when I noticed the option to boot from a tftp server. I started up tftp32j (a freeware Windows tftp client and syslog/dhcp/tftp server) on my workstation, rebooted the toaster, and flashed the bios across the network.

Running with that thought I unzipped the 2200linux.tgz file into the tftp server's shared directory and rebooted the toaster. It started to boot but stopped abruptly with a kernel panic when it couldn't contact an NFS server. I might try booting my workstation into Knoppix and setting up an NFS share. Has anyone tried this?

BTW...I put the original CF card back in and it still boots even after flashing the bios.

Chris

Posted by The Evil One on Feb. 12 2005,00:58

Hey folks

Interesting to find this thread, six months ago I couldn't find much bar one page about getting linux to run on the n2200 netvistas.

I've only skimmed the topic, and I know I'm repeating things that have been said, but here we go anyway:

* You can boot directly from the CF card by selecting the appropriate options from the BIOS. I can check the options when I return home.

* The BIOS in the netvista will only load an UNCOMPRESSED kernel image from the compact flash. This means that you will need to compile your own kernel for use on the device. You will want to do this for a number of reasons anyway (optimise the kernel, include specific support for devices in the kernel).

The main problem I've had is fitting a linux install onto the Compact Flash itself. I'm currently using the stock 96mb one that came with the device, which makes getting an install of linux on it terribly tricky (bar doing a LFS install). For my use as a portable mp3 player for my car, running something like DSL isnt suitable.

At the moment, I'm trying to build a cut-down debian-based distribution for the n2200, which will fit onto the stock 96mb cards, but I may end up just getting a bigger card. Down the track it will have several install targets (console mp3/ogg player, desktop, etc).

I would be interested in the meantime getting my hands on a copy of the n2200 linux that was mentioned in this thread.
If you need hosting for it, send an email to < support <@> autodeist.com > and I can have hosting set up within 24 hours free of charge.

Posted by The Evil One on Feb. 12 2005,01:18

Quote (Guest @ Feb. 10 2005,17:59)

Has anyone been able to get a USB wifi adapter to work? What about a USB external hard drive? I'd want to listen to shoutcast stations out in my workshop and play mp3/ogg files from the external hard drive, but I'd like to avoid running cat5 across the back yard (very low acceptance level by the old lady).

If you have USB mass storage support in your kernel, all you should need to do is install the hotplug service, and start it.

Then whenever you plug in a USB storage device, it should automatically detect and mount it for you. Then you just want to write a script to detect if this has happened, and automatically update your playlist (a cron job perhaps?)

Posted by 8363 on Feb. 12 2005,14:16

apeman + The Evil One

Thank you for your offer of help hosting the file, but i found a new "home" for the netvista linux. It's on:
< http://linux-2200.berlios.de/ >
If you want, you can download the file and host it.
I will try to put a FAQ und a Forum on the new site.
For the future i will improve the linux-2200 (thats now the name of the projekt) and put the newer versions on the site.

Posted by The Evil One on Feb. 13 2005,10:47

Excuse the continual editing of this post, I'm trying to make it as informative as possible ;)

I'm having difficulties getting either the firmware update or linx-2200 booting off the compact flash. I've previously gotten a linux kernel image to load up partially, but for some reason these things won't load.

It will find the image (bflash.2200 or kernel.2x00), proceed to load it off the card, then it stops and says it can't load the kernel.

Any thoughts?
Some information below about my configuration:

Quote

cypher:/# fdisk -l /dev/sda

Disk /dev/sda: 255 heads, 63 sectors, 11 cylinders
Units = cylinders of 16065 * 512 bytes

Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System
/dev/sda1 * 1 11 88326 83 Linux
cypher:/# mount /dev/sda1 /cflash/
cypher:/# ls /cflash/ -al
total 533
drwxr-xr-x 3 root root 1024 Feb 13 19:20 .
drwxr-xr-x 22 root root 4096 Feb 13 16:59 ..
-rwxr--r-- 1 root root 524392 Feb 13 19:20 bflash.2200
drwx------ 2 root root 12288 Feb 13 19:20 lost+found
cypher:/# mount
<snip>
/dev/sda1 on /cflash type ext2 (rw)

MODEL: 8363-EXX
Current BIOS: B3052500 (05/25/00)

Posted by The Evil One on Feb. 13 2005,12:31

Wow, okay... that was a random problem.... Turns out that copying files from my linux server onto the CF card doesnt work too well. It works fine from my machine here.

Yay

Posted by 8363 on Feb. 13 2005,15:52

The Evil One

Quote (The Evil One @ Feb. 13 2005,07:31)

Wow, okay... that was a random problem.... Turns out that copying files from my linux server onto the CF card doesnt work too well. It works fine from my machine here.

Excuse me, english is not my native lnguage an so i am not sure if i
understood you. Is it right, that the problem was your server?
Did the linux-2200 work on your Netvista now?

Sometimes i had trouble copying files with some CF Cards too.
I don't no why some Cards work and some not, but after formatting them in my camera and make a new linux partition the they mostly work fine.

cmilte

Quote

Has anyone been able to get a USB wifi adapter to work?

The kernel is not compiled with wireless lan support.

Quote

What about a USB external hard drive?

I don't have a USB hard drive, but i have a usb-stick and i think
USB hard drives work in the same way. so try to make:
mknod /dev/sda0 b 8 0
mknod /dev/sda1 b 8 1
modprobe usb-storage
mount -t vfat /dev/sda1 /your_mount_directory
or
mount /dev/sda1 /your_mount_directory

tackettb

Quote

Has anyone used a larger than 256mb cf on this?

No, i havent. If anyone tested it, please let us know.

Posted by 8363 on Feb. 14 2005,08:45

cbagger01

to add support for some wireless USB devices look at:

< http://linux-2200.berlios.de/atmelwlandriver.html >

Posted by rlussier on Feb. 18 2005,18:24

8363,

Big Thanks for all of your work on this project, my company is sitting on a gross of these things and I hope to be able to get some use out of them. I have a NetVista 2200 and after buying a new CF card, flashing the BIOS and some tinkering, I'm up on the network after using your instructions at < http://linux-2200.berlios.de/ >
This may be a better question for the Busybox or fluxbox sites, but I had the same problem as caulktel with the keyboard mapping. I fixed the /etc/init.d/rcS file to eliminate the loadkmap command, but I still have a German keyboard in xfree86. When I drop out of X and into a busybox shell my mappings are ok, but as soon as I "startx" my problem comes back. I've checked the XF86Config file and the XkbKeymap is set to xfree86(us).

Thanks Again,
Ron Lussier

Posted by 8363 on Feb. 18 2005,20:13

Ron ,

remove /usr/X11R6/lib/X11/xkb
or better rename into /usr/X11R6/lib/X11/xkb.ger

Posted by rlussier on Feb. 18 2005,20:50

8363,

Danke Schoen, that worked! I've also gotten Xmms to play MP3s, but I'll have to bring it home to see if it will stream audio, as I don't know how I'll get through the corporate proxy server with it.

Ron

Posted by caulktel on Feb. 18 2005,21:03

8363,

Thanks again for all the help. I had the same problem with the keyboard map. And Ron, XMMS is streaming Shoutcast everyday in my Shop with no problems other than loosing the stream once in a while. When I get some time I am going to try to setup Fluxbox a little better. I think I will copy DSL's over and try that.

Posted by rlussier on Feb. 22 2005,15:01

Joel, what is it about hams and obsolete gear? ;^)

My ulterior motive for getting this thing working is to build a cheap, maintenance-free, (and silent) computer lab in my church basement. If I could create a non-root user, install Firefox (using the instructions found elsewhere in this thread), and maybe a game or two, people could surf the web and check web-based e-mail for free. Maybe it will spark interest in linux among church geeks.

A long-term goal would be to integrate a linux server that could act as an app server/file repository/image upgrade point.

Big Respekt to the DSL Geeks in da house.

Ron, KB1KIN

Posted by LuWiki on Feb. 24 2005,21:26

8363,

great stuff. Copied your berlios tar onto my cf card, set the 2200 to boot from flash -

writing this reply from my wonderful silent NetVista system.

Thx a lot, LuWiki.

(had to bflash from 1/12/2001 to 7/29/02 from the IBM Website though)

Posted by TubbyTommy on Feb. 25 2005,20:39

Quote (LuWiki @ Feb. 24 2005,16:26)

8363,

great stuff. Copied your berlios tar onto my cf card, set the 2200 to boot from flash -

writing this reply from my wonderful silent NetVista system.

Thx a lot, LuWiki.

(had to bflash from 1/12/2001 to 7/29/02 from the IBM Website though)

Any chance of posting this link for us mere-mortals to flash our PROM's also?

Gracias.

TT.

Posted by 8363 on Feb. 26 2005,08:24

TT,
try this:
< http://www-1.ibm.com/support....c=en_US >
in netvistaltc.tar.gz there is a bflash.2200.
It seemed to be a newer version. I found it yesterday but i didn't find time to try it.
If it works, please post it.

Posted by jbaker on Feb. 28 2005,23:13

Hi there, has anyone seen this yet?

I am getting kernel panics on boot. I flashed with latest flash, and gunzip'd the tar file and extracted it to the CF card.

Im getting:
Kernel Panic: VFS: Unable to mount root fs on 03:01.

anyone have any ideas?

Thanks,
Jack.

Posted by 8363 on Mar. 01 2005,08:05

jbaker

read:

< http://damnsmalllinux.org/cgi-bin....4;st=25 >

it depends on the CF-card.
I have had the same trouble with a card.
As workaround i formatted the CF-card in my camera ( i didn't find a way to to that under linux).
After that i use cfdisk to make a linux partition and mke2fs for a linux filesystem.

Posted by jbaker on Mar. 01 2005,19:40

Yes, this is exactly what I did wrong.

I didn't format it as partition 1, i formated the entire card as a single partition.

You need to fdisk -> n, p, 1, w. then mke2fs the card.

Boom, it works perfect now

Thanks,
Jack.

Posted by madarasz on Mar. 11 2005,21:21

Hi all!

Does anybody knows a VOIP program for this stuff? It would be very useful.
Or skype's linux client can run on it ?

Posted by 8363 on Mar. 12 2005,07:58

madarasz,
i tried "gphone", in my lan it works fine but i never tried it on internet.

Posted by madarasz on Mar. 12 2005,12:33

Thanks a lot, i'll try it!

Posted by HalfNelson on Mar. 13 2005,08:21

Great work all of you.

Just a question. How difficult would it be to add a remote desktop client (windows rdp) to the linux distro so that it could still act as a thin client when the need arises?

Posted by 8363 on Mar. 13 2005,13:07

HalfNelson ,
to add applications lokk at:
< http://damnsmalllinux.org/cgi-bin....4;st=60 >

for windows rdp you need "rdesktop" i think. It ia available for Debian, so it should work on linux2200. If you don't have Debian, try an early Knoppix (3.1).

Posted by N2800 on Mar. 13 2005,13:16

Hey has anyone tried this Linux-2200 on an N2800 ? When booting it looks for the same /kernel.2x00. file.

Posted by 8363 on Mar. 13 2005,14:52

Quote (N2800 @ Mar. 13 2005,08:16)

Hey has anyone tried this Linux-2200 on an N2800 ? When booting it looks for the same /kernel.2x00. file.

N2800,
the kernel hangs while it tried to boot.
I use a CF-Card with a frugal DSL on my N2800, but you can use any other OS.
just change the boot-sequenz in the BIOS to harddisk.
See:
< http://www.freegeekmichiana.org/netvista.html >
for setup the BIOS

You can even start from harddisk when you connect it to the
connection block near the cf-card slot.

Posted by N2800 on Mar. 18 2005,01:21

On the N2800 that you changed the boot sequence to hard disk whick BIOS version are you using. Mine doesn't appear to be the same. It wants a location and file.

Posted by 8363 on Mar. 18 2005,07:51

Quote (Guest @ Mar. 17 2005,20:21)

On the N2800 that you changed the boot sequence to hard disk whick BIOS version are you using. Mine doesn't appear to be the same. It wants a location and file.

N2800,
Machine Type/Model: 8364EXX
Flash EEPROM Revision Leve: NZAA0DAUS
Boot Block Revision Level : NZ0DA
BIOS Date: 10081999

Posted by LinuxRocks on Mar. 19 2005,09:45

Well.. first I would like to thanks everyone on this post for their time contributed to the knowledge sharing that is the internet. Well done and I would have gotten nowhere without these posts (I have used many of the pointers

).

My contribution will be that I was succesful in running the berios 2200-0.1 from a 1G Extreme flashcard so is seems the NetVista 2200 cx1 can support large cards.

However, (I am still a linux newbie) I see a lot of, what I think are errors, when loading and running apps. Sure it boots the startx ok on boot but for example when running fluxbox error message appear and it seems to only partially work. I read somewhere someone had to tweek it after it was installed but are the messages normal? I wonder if I am missing any symlinks or such (I havent used any of the included apps so I am not familiar with them).

Is this normal due to the striping of content to make it run on a hardware limited machine such as this?

Also, I was able to get this kernal and files to boot accross the lan from my Fedora box NFS server. (same errors so I think it has to do with the stipping and I have to manually run startx)

Cheers!

Posted by 8363 on Mar. 19 2005,19:20

LinuxRocks,

Quote

I see a lot of, what I think are errors, when loading and running apps

You are right, there are a lot of error in the Linux2200 .
I just made it "quick and dirty". Sometimes i will clean it up.

Quote

for example when running fluxbox error message appear and it seems to only partially work

Yes, it needs the .fluxbox directory with the files : keys,menu, init and styles.
You can copy them from Debian 3.0 into the root directory of the CF-card.
In the file "ram" yuo must add "
cp -a .fluxbox /mnt
To load the backgrounds you need the command "bsetroot", you can copy it
cp /usr/bin/bsetroot /your-cf-card/usr/bin

Posted by LinuxRocks on Mar. 19 2005,20:04

8363,

As many have said, your input is greatly appreciated as always!

I will continue to play around with it.

Quote

You are right, there are a lot of error in the Linux2200 .
I just made it "quick and dirty". Sometimes i will clean it up.

Hey no problem, you paved the way for many of us to start our exploration of this. I figured as much but at least now I know it is not what I am doing (installiion, copying of files etc) that is causing the errors. This then lets me move from trying to get it installed properly to putting the focus on settings, configs etc.

Quote

Yes, it needs the .fluxbox directory with the files : keys,menu, init and styles.
You can copy them from Debian 3.0

I guess it is time for me to break out another VM partition for this

Thanks again and I will come back with any info that I feel others can use.

Posted by N2800 on Mar. 20 2005,15:42

Any chance anyone who has been able to boot a N2800 from a hard disk could post how they did it and where to get the bflash.2800 they used. mine dosen't seem to want to look for anything on the hard disk other than kernal.2x00.

Posted by 8363 on Mar. 20 2005,18:01

Did you do that:

Quote

Move the chassis around so that you are facing the front with the fan on your left.
Locate the on/off switch on the front panel. The switch should have a white plastic barrel
covering its shaft. The switch itself is mounted on the motherboard. Just to the right of the switch are a pair of jumper blocks. The jumper block closest to the front of the chassis is labeled PASSWORD OVR. Move the jumper to the left one pin so that it covers the leftmost pair of pins and the far right pin is exposed.
Start the unit. Count to twenty (20), and turn the system off. Move the jumper back to its original position covering the rightmost pair of pins and exposing the leftmost pin. Wait
at least 20 seconds PUT THE CF-Card into the slot and restart the system.

?

If yes, then you see first the blue screen with "Testing in progress"
WAIT
then there are appearing different screens
WAIT until you see a screen with
POST STARTUP ERROR(S)

go to CONTINUE
Then you get a screen with
ERROR
go to AUTOMATICALLY RECONFIGURE SYSTEM AND CONTINUE

Next screen -> CONFIGURITION ERROR
go to CONTINUE

next screen -> CONFIGURATION/SETUP UTILITY
here you choose
Start Options -> Setup Sequence ->Primary Startup Sequence
and choose
harddisk0

then 2X ESC
goto SAVE SETTINGS
ENTER

and the Netvista 2800 will boot again from CF-card.
When You connect a harddisk to the connector, you must
put a power cable from somewhere (a second power supply unit )
to the harddisk.

Posted by 8363 on Mar. 20 2005,18:11

ALL,
My previous posting is related to Netvista 2800 .
The Netvista 2800 unlike the 2200 could boot a DSL from CF-Card.

N2800,
my two Netvista 2800 never needed a bflash.2800

Posted by N2800 on Mar. 20 2005,18:34

It was the little bootblk jumper that was stopping me . Thanks It was driving me nuts , nothing would work.

Posted by 8363 on Mar. 20 2005,19:24

N2800,
So it works now?

I wrote, that you must take the power for the harddisk from somewhere.
After a look on the board i remember that the connector with 4 pins beside the CF-card-slot ist the power connector for the HD.
I don't know where you can get a plugfor that power connector.

Posted by N2800 on Mar. 20 2005,19:35

Yes , its booted up right now off a knoppix intall in text mode. The other BIOS was showing 128MB ram now it only sees 64MB. Is this normal ?
I think now I'll get 2 128MB ram modules and a 40 to 44 pin hd adapter so I can use a laptop hard drive.
I think this might be the needed power cable.
< http://www.pacificcable.com/Picture_Page.asp?DataName=IA3 >

Posted by 8363 on Mar. 20 2005,19:56

N2800,

Quote

The other BIOS was showing 128MB ram now it only sees 64MB. Is this normal ?

I don't know, i havn't look at it.

Quote

I think this might be the needed power cable.
< http://www.pacificcable.com/Picture_Page.asp?DataName=IA3 >

That looks good, here in Germany i can't get it, but i dont need it because i use CF-cards.

Posted by madarasz on Mar. 21 2005,21:08

HI!

I tried several CF cards. It dont works with Adata, Hitachi and Canon CFs, but it works with a E-memory CF.

With the A-data CF, it can only boot one time.

I wanna to try Xmms, but is dont works! It can't acces the sound card.
How can I define a DNS server's address on it?

Posted by 8363 on Mar. 22 2005,17:23

madarasz ,

Quote

I tried several CF cards. It dont works with Adata, Hitachi and Canon CFs,.

read:

< http://damnsmalllinux.org/cgi-bin....4;st=25 >

it depends on the CF-card.
I have had the same trouble with a card.
As workaround i formatted the CF-card in my camera ( i didn't find a way to to that under linux).
After that i use cfdisk to make a linux partition and mke2fs for a linux filesystem.

Quote

It can't acces the sound card.

go to xmms -> option ->preferences ->audio io/plugins -> output plugin ->
configure -> klick on "use alternative device" and change "dev/dsp or whatever " to /dev/sound/audio",
to save it make "cp -a .xmms hda"

Quote

How can I define a DNS server's address on it?

You can define the Network settings in the Firmware .
Press ESC while the firmware is booting.
The Thin Client will then show you the

IBM Netvista thin client Advanced Configuration

Posted by madarasz on Mar. 25 2005,18:50

Thanks, the sound card works

I edited resolv.conf file to set the DNS server.

About the CFs: i just tried all of my cards, fortunatly i find one witch works good with this stuff

Posted by 8363 on April 02 2005,07:33

madarasz,

Quote

I edited resolv.conf file to set the DNS server.

Thats right, i forgot to tell.

Quote

About the CFs: i just tried all of my cards, fortunatly i find one witch works good with this stuff

Sometimes i play around with cfdisk and change the heads, cylinders and sectors of the cf-card so that the have the same values as a working card. It sometime works.

Posted by caulktel on April 11 2005,23:59

8363,

Did you change something on your site? It appears that the download file has changed, but I may be wrong. If so what has changed?

Posted by 8363 on April 12 2005,18:57

caulktel;
i didn't change anything.
I have just download the file and tested it.
There is everything it was.

By the way: I have a newer Version with a more configurated Fluxbox and Kphone.
If someone is interestedt, i will upload it on the berlios side.
I

Posted by caulktel on April 13 2005,02:43

8363,

That would be great if you don't mind. I was going to configure Fluxbox myself, but didn't want to go to the trouble of removing the CF card and putting it in my linux box just for that. I think I will pickup another CF card to put it on so I can keep the one I'm using now as a spare. Thanks again.

Posted by TubbyTommy on April 13 2005,12:14

Hey 8363 (and all!),

I've been trying to compile my own kernel from my Unbuntu box, following the instructions from the NetVista-HOWTO.html and your guidance. I read that you built your system on a Debian machine - and Unbuntu is based on that, so I thought it would be relatively easy. I've compiled a 2.4.21 kernel + listed patches, without errors, and set the 8363 to boot via NFS.

However, my 02-updated PBOM on my N2200-8363 begins to load the kernel - then hangs with the IBM load screen becoming distorted from the top of the screen.

How do you (or did you) error check your kernel when you were building it? By that, I'm presuming you had some build errors or non-working kernel builds during your time spent developing your build: How did you check these to find out where the failure was?

Oh, and I wasn't sure if I should post to the DSL forum or the berlios one - hope I made the right choice!

All the best!

TT.

Posted by 8363 on April 13 2005,14:10

TubbyTommy,
Ubunto uses Debian Sid (testing) i think. I compiled the kernel with Debian Woddy (stable).
The version of gcc Sid uses is a newer one.

Quote

How do you (or did you) error check your kernel when you were building it?

I dont check it

Quote

I'm presuming you had some build errors or non-working kernel

No, i downloaded the source, patch it , compiled it and it works.

By the way: An unpachted 2.4.21 kernel will work too.

Quote

Oh, and I wasn't sure if I should post to the DSL forum or the berlios one - hope I made the right choice!

I try to answer on both forums. As long as the people of the DSL-Forum would allow it.

Posted by TubbyTommy on April 13 2005,14:42

Thanks for your reply.

That's very bizarre in that case. My 8363 will boot very happily from your distro - but every kernel I compile hangs at exactly the same point in the early boot process.

Yet, if I copy my newely compiled kernel to my /boot/ and add them to my grub boot list, I can happily load the kernel on my Unbuntu box.

I wonder how I can find what is going wrong. Can you give me an exact version of gcc from your development machine, please [ gcc - v]?

Thanks,

TT.

Posted by 8363 on April 13 2005,17:10

TubbyTommy ,
gcc -v
Reading specs from /usr/lib/gcc-lib/i386-linux/2.95.4/specs
gcc version 2.95.4 20011002 (Debian prerelease)

Posted by caulktel on April 13 2005,18:32

8363,

It would seem that your tar.gz file is corrupt. I downloaded it and used KDE to untar it and it errored out. I also did it from the command line using the info on your site, and got an error also. Something about a really old time stamp. It does produce the folder though, I'm just not sure wether the contents are going to be corrupt or not. Any ideas? BTW, I did this using Kubuntu. Last time I used DSL.

Posted by TubbyTommy on April 13 2005,19:34

Quote (8363 @ April 13 2005,13:10)

TubbyTommy ,
gcc -v
Reading specs from /usr/lib/gcc-lib/i386-linux/2.95.4/specs
gcc version 2.95.4 20011002 (Debian prerelease)

Yes, my version is much newer: gcc version 3.3.5 (Debian
1:3.3.5-8ubuntu2)

My kernel vmlinux seems to compile at a weighty 2.6Mb - is this image too large to boot on the N2200? Do you know if the kernel needs to be under a certain size?

Cheers!

TT.

Posted by 8363 on April 14 2005,08:09

TubbyTommy,

Quote

My kernel vmlinux seems to compile at a weighty 2.6Mb - is this image too large to boot on the N2200?

No,
2660013 8. Dez 11:52 kernel.2x00

caulktel

Quote

It would seem that your tar.gz file is corrupt

I just downloaded it and testet it. On my Debian Woody it works without errors.
Maybe something got wrong when you downloaded it.
You can test if the file is corrupt ,
make md5sum linux-2200-0.2.1.tar.gz
the result must be
9de034bef83e3f3dd5b22755ae5a7565

I just googled around and find anoteher possible reason for the error.
In one Forum the say:

Quote

It could well be a gnutar version problem.

Did you try it with another tar-version (like the one in DSL) ?

Posted by 8363 on April 14 2005,08:13

caulktel,
i compressed it with
tar --version
tar (GNU tar) 1.13.25
gzip --version
gzip 1.3.2
(2001-11-03)

which comes with Woody

Posted by TubbyTommy on April 14 2005,10:04

8363,

I also tried to download and decompress your archive.

Using Nautulis package manager and also by tar zxvf - it bombed out stating that the archive (in various places) had an implausibily old time-stamp dated in 1943! Yowzaz!

Any chance you could repackage and repost?

Cheers,

TT.

Posted by caulktel on April 14 2005,13:50

The problem must be with the newer versions of Tar that we are using, so I will try again only from DSL.

Posted by 8363 on April 14 2005,14:05

TubbyTommy ,caulktel
i just downloded the current DSL (1.0), burn it on CD and boot it.
Then i download the linux-2200-0.2.1.tar.gz file with DSL (1.0 comes with Firefox , great)
and make tar -xzf. It works without errors.

Posted by TubbyTommy on April 14 2005,14:59

Weirdness. It must be, as Caulktel stated: Our tar's are newer and must have a bug present. In fact, I'm having a great number of NFS issues with Unbuntu Hoary-Hedgehog, currently - so I wouldn't be surprised!

Anyway... back to it - I've downloaded a fresh batch of 2.4.21 kernel source and stuff, and have cleanely compiled a new kernel (at 2.5Mb), so lets see if I can get it to boot [I use NFS to test my kernel's to see if they boot first, before taking the case off the N2200 to play with the CF image]

TT.

Posted by TubbyTommy on April 14 2005,23:03

All.

Finally managed to get gcc-2.9.5-22 installed correctly on my Unbuntu developement box.

Compiled a 2.4.21 kernel+*no* patches.

Added that to 8363's published boot / filesystem.

My N2200 8363 now boots my very own compiled kernel!

Thanks for all input so far - more reports as I progress.

**Essential info: N2200 8363 with a 2.4.21 kernel *must* be compiled using a v.2.95 gcc compiler - for a correctly formatted kernel image - this cannot be deduced from the different size of the kernel images**

TT.

Posted by madarasz on May 07 2005,13:04

Thanks for the new soft, it works well!

How can I save kphone's settings?

Thanks
Peter

Posted by 8363 on May 08 2005,10:07

madarasz,

Fluxbox/Linux2200 Menu --> Save Preferences

Posted by linuxboy on May 10 2005,08:42

I don't know anything about IBM NetVista thin clients, but when you are turning it on you might be able to hold down F1 of ESC to make it go to a special menu. From there you should be able to choose different boot options.
I don't know if it will work

(it worked on a ThinkPad...):)

Posted by caulktel on May 11 2005,04:47

8363,

I just got around to loading your new version onto my Netvista machine, ( I was sick for the last month). I've got to say you did a good job improving it. It is now performing all the tasks I set out for it do, and it looks so much better with Fluxbox configured. One thing I can't seem to get figured out though, is how to get the keyboard layout to US. I did it once, but it would not stay. Can you refresh my memory? Thanks,

Joel

Posted by 8363 on May 11 2005,08:31

caulktel,

for X

remove /usr/X11R6/lib/X11/xkb
or better rename into /usr/X11R6/lib/X11/xkb.ger

but it is a workaround, not the right way (i just try to find out the right way)

without X

Look at /etc/init.d/rcS and delete or comment out the line
"loadkmap < /key.map" .

Posted by adam on May 23 2005,18:35

Hi,

I've been following this thread with great interest for several weeks, and with some googling and kernel hacking I'm now sat at my 8363 running as an X-terminal!

I was especially interested about the keymap discussion - I still have failed to get the Linux2200 X to use anything other than either german or US keymappings in X. Can you tell me how to make sure X uses a UK / GB keymap? This is the one thing I have yet to conquer! The xf86config uses the XkbdLayout, but this seems to make no difference what I alter it to.

Thanks for all your hard work, the 8363 is a great little machine once a little love and care has been furnished upon it!

Regards,

Adam.

Posted by 8363 on May 24 2005,18:50

Adam,
im afraid i coulndn't help you very much. As i wrote on the linux-2200.berlios
site i made it "doing by learning". I didn't found out how the
language stuff really work. The basis of linux-2200 is my Debian 3.0 (Woody)
installation on my Desktop-Pc, when i installed it, the Debian installation
program asked me which language - so i only installed the german keys.
To use it on the 8363 i made a
dumpkmap > key.map
and put the key.map into the linux-2200.
Maybe it will work, when you have a Debian 3.0 with the GB keymap and make a
dumpkmap > key.map .
Sorry i couldn't help you, but the next weeks i have no time to find out more.

Posted by mark on May 28 2005,10:07

hi,
apart from partitioning and then formatting my card as ext2 and placing the bflash.2200 file onto it are there any setting on the n2200 i need to adjust to make it see the bios update.

mine just sits there and goes about its business as if there was a compact flash card. i've tried default setting and everything under the sun.

does the cf patition need to be set as bootable?
the linux-2200.berlios.de instructions don't mention that.

regards, mark.

also... couldn't a linux kernal be compiled so that i could be a direct drop-in replacement for dsl's kernal? or even knoppix if a 1gig cf card was used. you can recompile the kernal to inculde things you need so why not just with an uncompressed kernal output?

Posted by jyrts on June 12 2005,19:00

Hi, is there any possibility to run Slackware linux on N2200? I know the initrd problem - but ain't it possible to
to integrate the initrd options into the uncompressed vmlinux itself?

Posted by Gav on July 01 2005,11:58

Hi all,

Has anyone got kernel 2.6 working on an N2200 yet? If so how? I really want to use my ati remote control with it!

Posted by krevo on July 20 2005,17:05

Well...I followed the N2200.linux HOWTO exactly...moved folder onto card...put .xinitrc and .fluxbox on the same directory...

and when mine posts, it comes up saying Authentication failed (for network boot) and then shows the netvista wire to a desktop PC image. However, it just sits there. Doesn't go any further.

This system came with TurboLinux, but it's not very functional and I can't change the net settings due to admin password on the rom.

Posted by mwdmeyer on Aug. 03 2005,12:33

Hey everyone,

I've got 4 8363 EXX systems here. I am trying to get linux2200 working on it. I've copied the files to the CF card. When I tried to boot it looks as though it is reading the kernel and then the system just powers off. Any ideas? I too cannot get the BIOS upgrade to work either.

Ideas?

Thanks!
mwdmeyer.

Posted by mwdmeyer on Aug. 03 2005,22:41

Never mind, I got it working. I reformatted the card and upgraded the BIOS. All working now.
The only problem is that the keyboard isn't fully detected, things like the : letter don't work. Any ideas?

Posted by mqarkcambie on Aug. 15 2005,22:45

I have a N2200 and intend to use it as an always on portal to my network, a small ftp server and a tool for updating my dynamic IP address using no-ip service.

I have the unit up and running, it's all lovely and I'm very happy. I had even gotten used to the german keymap!

I've downloaded the no-ip update client for linux (which supports debian) and have tried to follow the instructions here:

< http://www.no-ip.com/guides.php/id/13 >

(yep - sorry I am a newbie

)

I can get as far as wgetting the file, untaring it and being able to look around the folders, but I don't see how I can use Make or stuff like that. Is all that kind of thing included in this build?

Secondally, is it possible to run the following things:

1) http server or httpd
2) ftp server
3) vnc

I guess I'm really lazy, but has anyone taken the great work done in the initial build and made something really sweet?
Is it possible to post images of your versions?

Thanks,
Mark.

Posted by mwdmeyer on Aug. 16 2005,23:18

I did a quick howto here:
< http://www.bluetrait.com/archive....00-8363 >

Maybe of interest to new people.

Posted by mqarkcambie on Aug. 17 2005,10:20

Hi, yeah I saw your page, but I am probably at the same stage you are at with it.

I have a working system, but My linux knowledge isn't so hot and I was wondering if anyone had taken this project further.

I have run the DSL live CD on my windows pc, but have had little luck in being able to copy the components of say monkey httpd onto my ntfs drives then copying that onto my cf flash.

At the very least I need help with the no-ip client, and further to that to make me a very happy bunny I'd like either to put DSL 1.4 as is on my CF card, as I really like the live cd's setup (it does everything I need), or I need to know how to put VNC, FTP server and monkey httpd onto this image.

How far have you got? Can you shed any light on where to go from here?

Posted by Daniel on Aug. 20 2005,13:07

I have a model of 8363 type from year 2000.
When I put the power supply, the "power on" led only blink for a short time then goes off, and the Netvista Thin client does'n start.
I put the power supply on the other model (with Ciryx processor - from 1999 edition) and works fine.
It's there a trik to make the new type work, because I hope is not damaged, because the situation happents from first time when I tryed put it to work.
If is not any trick, then is broken for shure.
Thanks for respose!

Posted by me again on Aug. 20 2005,13:36

I think I found the answer:
"Unfortunately my WXX doesn’t power on, it seems as though about 7 capacitors have blown on the system. I am looking into replacing them although I don’t know if this will bring it back to life. The capacitors are 1500 microfarad at 6.3volts (although voltage isn’t an issue as long as it is at least 6.3volts)."
I found this at:
< http://www.bluetrait.com/archive....00-8363 >

Posted by Daniel on Aug. 20 2005,16:09

Two observations:
1. My "backspace" don't work.
2. I use'd two RAM modules (256 MB) succesivly of course and every time my Xmms was crashed. Without, the 8363 works fine ?!? ... ;-(

Posted by Tom Quinn on Aug. 24 2005,06:16

Hi all,

As I am having trouble booting my N2200 into a 'rdesktop' screen, I thought I would ask if anyone has the Firmware for a NetVista N2200(EXX OR WXX) for Booting WBT(Window Based Terminal)

A kind friend sent me a copy(dd) of thier 16MB Flash Card that Booted straight into WBT(Windows CE), however there's was a NetVista N2200(8363 WXX) while mine is a NetVista N2200(8363 EXX)

Because of the different Firmware, I get the ERROR:
--------------------------------------------------
NSB02500 This thin client not authorized to load the window based terminal operating system
--------------------------------------------------

My original Firmware is: NS Boot Version B3052500 (05/25/00)

I also tried a Linux specific version - BL072902(07/09/02) but that also did not work

BTW: If anyone wants a copy of WBT v1.5(Windows CE) for the IBM NETVISTA 2200 let me know - it fits onto a 16MB Compact Flash card

Tom

Posted by Felicity on Aug. 24 2005,16:30

Can some kind person please please help us newbies & supply the latest "rdesktop v1.4.1"
ready to copy across onto the Flash Card in either tar.gz or zip/rar format

I have tried to install rdesktop but after a successful configure, I get errors on make

This has been requested before but as yet no one has replied

Posted by John on Aug. 25 2005,05:46

Quote (Guest @ Aug. 24 2005,12:30)

Can some kind person please please help us newbies & supply the latest "rdesktop v1.4.1"

I have installed rdesktop v1.4.1 OK

Tested it by connecting to windows 2003 & all is OK

Someone tell me what rdesktop files you need so I can copy them from my Linux box for you ?

I can host them on my homepage(zip/rar)

my rdesktop executable is located in /usr/local/bin/

are there lots of other rdesktop files/libs/ .. etc ??

John

Posted by Tom Quinn on Aug. 25 2005,10:44

Quote (Guest @ Aug. 20 2005,12:09)

Two observations:
1. My "backspace" don't work.

Same happened to me ... only the backspace acts like the delete button when using it through rdesktop

Posted by mark on Aug. 25 2005,12:30

John,

Please let me know if you know how to run or install succesfully the following programs ./ services on a net vista:

1) VNC
2) FTP server
3) httpd (like monkey)

your help would be very appreciated!

Regards,
Mark.

Posted by Tom Quinn on Aug. 26 2005,03:03

I managed to install rdesktop & successfully got v1.4.1 to run on the NetVista N2200 & connect to Windows Server 2003

))

My settings: rdesktop -k en-us -f -x l -a 16

** 2 Problems I have though:

1) Even though xTerm can run Full Screen, RDP from Windows Server 2003 appears at 15" size on my 17" monitor ??
- Even though I used the correct Full Screen Flag

2) 1 Keyboard key is not working properlly
The 'Backspace' key acts/works like the 'Delete' key & does NOT backspace
- Even though I am using the 'en-us' flag

Any way to fix these 2 problems

Tom

Posted by DK on Aug. 26 2005,10:27

Quote (8363 @ Jan. 28 2005,10:03)

Quote (TubbyTommy @ Jan. 28 2005,08:43)

TT,

no, i think it is not possible, because the ibm firmware
bootloader dont tell the kernel to use initrd.

Hi 8363

I have installed & run your linux N2200 kernel distro

I would like to boot(either from server or compact flash) the N2200
from PXES(http://pxes.sourceforge.net/) as all this Linux distro contains are 7 different login clients

But I have 1 question:

You say: "the ibm firmware bootloader dont tell the kernel to use initrd"

Could you tell me the order & what files the N2200 boots ?

ie.
1) vmlinuz linux kernel (uncompressed) - what file is loaded next ??
2) NOT initrd - then what ??
3) ??

Because to boot PXES the order is:
1) pxelinux.0
2) pxelinux.cfg
3) vmlinuz-pxes.i586
4) pxes.squash

DK

Posted by mwdmeyer on Aug. 27 2005,01:48

rdesktop howto:
< http://www.bluetrait.com/archive....ux-2200 >

Posted by 8363 on Aug. 27 2005,12:04

Quote

Could you tell me the order & what files the N2200 boots ?

ie.
1) vmlinuz linux kernel (uncompressed) - what file is loaded next ??
2) NOT initrd - then what ??
3) ??

The Kernel is searching for "init" .
In this case "init" is a function of "busybox".
If Busybox-init didn't find an "inittab" it will run "etc/init.d/rcS"
(thats the way Linux2200 starts)

8363

Posted by mqarkcambie on Aug. 27 2005,12:42

8363,

is it possible to build a distro based on the current DSL by using your compiled kernal and any modified files that are needed to start it properly.

Have you added any additional software apps or utilities into your build that makes it more useable?

I'd specifically like my machine to be able to run just these 4 things:

1) vnc
2) monkey httpd
3) an ftp server
4) a dynamic ip update client such as the no-ip.com one

Thanks for all you hard work by the way, there seems to be a lot of people who have good reason to be thankful for the work you have done

Best Regards,
Mark Campbell.

Posted by DK on Aug. 27 2005,14:28

Quote (8363 @ Aug. 27 2005,08:04)

Quote

DK
Could you tell me the order & what files the N2200 boots ?

ie.
1) vmlinuz linux kernel (uncompressed) - what file is loaded next ??
2) NOT initrd - then what ??
3) ??

The Kernel is searching for "init" .
In this case "init" is a function of "busybox".
If Busybox-init didn't find an "inittab" it will run "etc/init.d/rcS"
(thats the way Linux2200 starts)

8363

thnx 8363 for that prompt reply

So the kernel searches for init which in this case is busybox-init

Is the search for a busy-box init compiled into the kernel OR
is it a standard for ALL Linux kernels to search for an init file after the kernel loads ??

The reason I ask is in relation to booting PXES(http://pxes.sourceforge.net/) on N2200

As the PXES boots in order:
1) pxelinux.0
2) pxelinux.cfg
3) vmlinuz-pxes.i586
4) pxes.squash

where the config file pxelinux.cfg contains the directive:
kernel vmlinuz-pxes.i586
append ramdisk_size=16384 initrd=pxes.squash root=/dev/ram

AND as the N2200 can NOT boot PXE style(ie. pxelinux.0) BUT can boot an Un-Compressed Linux kernel

IF I get an Un-Compressed kernel "vmlinuz-pxes.i586" & boot straight to this(which N22200 can do)
will this kernel Automatically load "pxes.squash" OR will it look for some other init file ??

IF it looks for some other init file WITHOUT the directive of "pxelinux.cfg",
HOW do I work out what this init file is ??

DK

Posted by 8363 on Aug. 27 2005,19:52

Quote

IF I get an Un-Compressed kernel "vmlinuz-pxes.i586" & boot straight to this(which N22200 can do)
will this kernel Automatically load "pxes.squash" OR will it look for some other init file ??

I don't know, but i suppose it will look for init.

Quote

IF it looks for some other init file WITHOUT the directive of "pxelinux.cfg",
HOW do I work out what this init file is ??

I have no ideas, sorry.

8363

Posted by Inquisitive one on Aug. 27 2005,21:55

Has ANYONE really gone to town to build a nice net vista system?

Can we see some screenshots of great looking desktops running interesting and useful programs on this little box.

Posted by D on Aug. 28 2005,03:29

Hi 8363,

1.1)
Is the search for a busy-box init compiled into the 2200 kernel
OR
is it a standard for ALL Linux kernels to search for an init file after the kernel loads ??

1.2)
IF so, what is the standard init file name that the Kernel looks for ??

2)
Lastly, do you know how to make a 'BackUp' copy of your exisiting Firmware(bios) BEFORE flashing over it ??

thnx for your help 8363 :;):

Posted by 8363 on Aug. 28 2005,10:17

Quote

is it a standard for ALL Linux kernels to search for an init file after the kernel loads ??

yes

Quote

IF so, what is the standard init file name that the Kernel looks for ??

/sbin/init
/bin/init
/etc/init

Quote

Lastly, do you know how to make a 'BackUp' copy of your exisiting Firmware(bios) BEFORE flashing over it ??

i've never done it, but take a look at:
< http://www-307.ibm.com/pc....-4KUJ5P >

mqarkcambie

Quote

is it possible to build a distro based on the current DSL by using your compiled kernal and any modified files that are needed to start it properly.

Maybe, but i don't know how. When i get my first Netvista 2200 i tried it, but i've not been able do run DSL. So i gave up.

Quote

Have you added any additional software apps or utilities into your build that makes it more useable?

I tried "monkey". But it is a little bit difficult.
You have to load other programms like "useradd" and have to make
the file /etc/passwd and some other things i don't remember because i don't do something with the Netvista for the last months.
So it is possible, but you have to try it by yourself.
How to add apps see at:
< http://damnsmalllinux.org/cgi-bin....4;st=60 >
or:
< http://www.bluetrait.com/archive....00-8363 >

Quote

Can we see some screenshots of great looking desktops running interesting and useful programs on this little box.

on:
< http://developer.berlios.de/dbimage.php?id=1326 >
is a screenshoot of the older Version.
Maybe i find some time and make some of the newer Version

8363

Posted by 8363 on Aug. 28 2005,14:28

Screenshhots
< https://developer.berlios.de/screenshots/?group_id=3096 >

Posted by DK on Aug. 29 2005,04:10

Quote (8363 @ Aug. 28 2005,06:17)

Quote

is it a standard for ALL Linux kernels to search for an init file after the kernel loads ??

yes

Quote

IF so, what is the standard init file name that the Kernel looks for ??

/sbin/init
/bin/init
/etc/init
8363

thnx for that info 8363

I will look into what init files are in PXES to boot that

Q:
For the current 'linux-2200-0.2.1.tar.gz', do you know what needs to be changed in any of the config files
to have this Linux OS boot from the Network INSTEAD of the Flash Card ??

ie. Boot linux.2x00 Kernel directly from the Network

I can Boot the Kernel from the Network easily enough but after the Kernel loads,
the rest of the init file loads & then HALTS/PAUSES at line: eth0 ??

I assume it pauses/halts at this line because of stuff in the config files

Do you know what I need to change in any of the config files so it Boots
from the Network Fully in RAM 'without' the use of the flash card ??

DK

Posted by 8363 on Aug. 29 2005,06:16

Quote

For the current 'linux-2200-0.2.1.tar.gz', do you know what needs to be changed in any of the config files
to have this Linux OS boot from the Network INSTEAD of the Flash Card ??

I never tried to boot from network, but someone who called himself LUWIKI wrote a
NetworkBoot-Howto :
< http://openfacts.berlios.de/index.phtml?title=NetworkBoot >

8363

Posted by DK on Aug. 29 2005,09:30

Quote (8363 @ Aug. 29 2005,02:16)

Quote

For the current 'linux-2200-0.2.1.tar.gz', do you know what needs to be changed in any of the config files
to have this Linux OS boot from the Network INSTEAD of the Flash Card ??

I never tried to boot from network, but someone who called himself LUWIKI wrote a
NetworkBoot-Howto :
< http://openfacts.berlios.de/index.phtml?title=NetworkBoot >

8363

Excellent HowTo .... for the unix world

I am trying to do something similar using MS Windows Server 2003 & TFTP (NOT NFS as in the HowTo) ??

I would like to contact LUWIKI, but I went to his website & as its all in German, I could work out a Contact Email Address ??

Does anyone understand how to get the following thats for NFS(below) working using TFTP ??

Linux-2200 - Network Boot
-----------------------------------------------
Setting up the server
1. Get Linux2200 from the Berlios Website
2. Tar the file to a directory you can export via NFS (I use /nvlinux)
3. Add the following line to your /etc/exports "/nvlinux 192.168.1.0/255.255.255.0(rw,no_root_squash,async)"
4. Do a "exportfs -a"
5. add the following to your /etc/dhcp3/dhcpd.conf (don't forget to do a "/etc/init.d/dhp3-server restart" and use your own IP and MAC addresses)
( at the beginning)
option option-211 code 211 = text;

(in your subnet section)
subnet 192.168.1.0 netmask 255.255.255.0 {
use-host-decl-names on;
option broadcast-address 255.255.255.0;
option routers 192.168.1.1;

# Netvista 2200 Station1
host ncperf1 {
option option-211 "nfs";
hardware ethernet 00:60:94:2A:9E:B3;
fixed-address 192.168.1.57;
option host-name "ncperf1";
filename "/nvlinux/kernel.2x00";
}
}
------------------------------------------------

DK

Posted by Mr Simes on Aug. 29 2005,16:27

Hi!
I have a N2200 with BIOS revision 01/28/00.
I'm trying to update the BIOS using the bflash.2200 file, but the NS simply displays "file not found on flash card" whenever I try to boot it up.

I've tried two different flash cards (a Sandisk and a Samsung), both are recognised in the Display Hardware Info menu on the NS.
I'm guessing this BIOS does not recognise the ext2 file system.
I've even tried formatting the CF card as FAT16 and placing the file on the card. It just won't read the file.
Do I need to flash the BIOS up to a newer level some other way?

Any advice greatly appreciated.

Simon

Posted by dow on Aug. 30 2005,17:32

Hello, first post here.

I'm looking for some help on my netvista 2200. When I try to flash the bios, I can specify that it boot from flash, then F3 to accept the change. Then under the Configure Network Settings, there's a sub heading that says, "Change Boot File Server Settings." However, when I move down to that heading and hit Enter, it just goes away, leaving me with the original optoins in the Bios setup.

How can I get this thing to update?

BTW, Currently running Bios version BL120601 (12/06/01)

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

dow

Posted by mqarkcambie on Aug. 30 2005,18:09

Well,

It looks like there are enough people here that are interested, and there is enough potential for people to supply netvista boxes with our own build of DSL.

Does anybody know a friendly linux head who is enough of an expert to take 8363's work and build a stong linux distro on it to equal the versatility of the current DSL desktop.

I'm not trying to tread on anybodys toes or disrespect the work done so far, but I sure don't want to have to learn linux from the ground up just to use a desktop and some apps. Surely there are people with this absurd level of knowledge who can help? How do we get te experts from the other ares of the forum involved?

Posted by 8363 on Aug. 30 2005,18:55

mqarkcambie
full acknowledge

Quote

I'm not trying to tread on anybodys toes or disrespect the work done so far,

it's OK. It's a god idea to ask for help, cause i don't have the knowledge (and i'm a bit lazzy)to develope a
full distribution for the Netvista 2200. Most thing in linux2200 i did by try and error.
A DSL for this quiet little things would be fine.
8363

Posted by mqarkcambie on Aug. 30 2005,20:45

Hehe, I'm glad I didn't offend you!

I have used a mixture of command line linux and X based linux before, but I've never had to go this far down, and I've certainly never compiled a kernal or built my own distro before!

I am in awe of the people who have the knowledge and ability to do this stuff.

I just don't have the time to learn yet another system. But I can see the obvious advantages of linux. And this project has such great potential because these machines are so cheap on ebay and they are really quiet and convineient.

I'd love to have the power of the DSL live CD on this box, and I hope we can find someone willing to invest some time and knowledge into taking it further. I'm sure we'd all like to benefit from DSL on our netvista's.

If paypal allowed you to send drinks, I'd certainly buy the person who could put DSL on the netvista for us a beer or two

Posted by DK on Sep. 01 2005,17:00

Hi 8363,

I have a question on the RAM file & my total RAM of 96MB

In the RAM file, the setting is 50000(I assume that is 50MB)

1)
If you run 'rdesktop' on top of fluxbox, does it use the RAM space thats is allocated from the 50MB ??

2)
OR If I have 96MB of RAM & 50MB is allocated by Linux(fluxbox), does RDP use the remaining 46MB ??

3)
If I have 96MB of RAM, should I set the RAM file to 96000 so it is allocated ALL the RAM ??

OR is there a situation where you want 46MB remaining for something else related to RDP or the Linux OS ??

DK

Posted by asdzxc on Sep. 04 2005,03:26

Q: How do I network-share a thin-client printer ??

Hi 8363,

If I attach a USB printer to the USB Port of the N2200,
can you tell me what I would need to Edit & in what Config File to enable the N2200 to use a printer attached to the USB port ??

thanks

DK

Posted by asdzxc on Sep. 09 2005,10:18

Hi all,

I have a 'Xerox DocuPrint P8ex' Laser Printer connected to the Thin Client 'USB Port'

I can NOT seem to Print to this USB Printer either directly from the command prompt OR via RDP connected to Windows Server 2003 & using TCP printing
(works fine if printer connected to a Windows Box)

I have tried:
cat a > /dev/usblp0 - & I got NO error & NO printing
cat a > /dev/usb - & I got NO error & NO printing
cat a > /dev/usb1 - & I got NO error & NO printing
cat a > /dev/usb3 - & I got NO error & NO printing

I also tried: -r printer:usb3="Xerox DocuPrint P8ex"
output: PRINTER PRN1 to usb3 driver Xerox Douc P8ex
& NO Printing

Doing a modprobe printer outputs nothing

I have a directory /dev/usb/ but NO /dev/printer/

Do I need to install a driver or something

I am a Linux noob, so ANY help is greatly appreciated

# dmesg | grep usb
usb.c: registered new driver usbdevfs
usb.c: registered new driver hub
host/usb-uhci.c: $Revision: 1.275 $ time 17:00:43 Mar 1 2005
host/usb-uhci.c: High bandwidth mode enabled
host/usb-uhci.c: v1.275:USB Universal Host Controller Interface driver
host/usb-ohci.c: USB OHCI at membase 0xc6e10000, IRQ 11
host/usb-ohci.c: usb-00:13.0, Compaq Computer Corporation ZFMicro Chipset USB
usb.c: new USB bus registered, assigned bus number 1
usb.c: registered new driver hid
usb.c: registered new driver serial
usbserial.c: USB Serial support registered for Generic
usbserial.c: USB Serial Driver core v1.4
usbserial.c: USB Serial support registered for Keyspan PDA
usbserial.c: USB Serial support registered for Keyspan PDA - (prerenumeration)
usbserial.c: USB Serial support registered for Belkin / Peracom / GoHubs USB
Serial Adapter
input0: USB HID v1.00 Keyboard [04b3:3001] on usb1:2.0
input1: USB HID v1.00 Mouse [04b3:3001] on usb1:2.1
usb.c: USB device 3 (vend/prod 0x419/0x3201) is not claimed by any active driver.

Posted by 8363 on Sep. 23 2005,19:49

there is no printer support on linux-2200

Posted by trialex on Oct. 11 2005,04:26

Great work 8363 - everyone owes you a lot!

When I try to boot my N2200 I get "No flash card detected". I'm pretty sure that I have created partitions and file systems correctly - is this a symptom of a simply uncompatible card? It's a cheap no-name brand. Unfortunately I don't have any more on me to give others a try...

Thanks!

trialex

Posted by trialex on Oct. 14 2005,09:46

Ok solved my own question

If you get the message "No flash card detected" it's pretty certain that your flash card isn't compatible.

Try a SanDisk card - worked for me!

Posted by thedevil on Oct. 17 2005,08:26

ok, back to the original topic. dsl on n2200.

i managed to get dsl started on n2200 using nfsroot (don't have any cf card lying around). 2 problems so far.

1. n2200 doesn't support kernel argument so initrd is out. without it i either have to allow rw on nfsroot (or cf card) or create a ramdisk post-boot and start dsl from that. what i've done so far is to populate the nfsroot with minirt24.img and hack the /etc/init script to create a ramdisk using (modified) minirt24.img as a cloned before chrooting to the ramdisk. the problem is, after mouning knoppix image the init program doesn't work (because we're in chrooted environment?) so i have to call /bin/bash instead of /etc/init. /.bashrc will take care of calling the appropriate scripts in /etc/init.d/* (knoppix-autoconfig and dsl-config) i also have to hack knoppix-autoconfig to add command lines (eg. nopcmcia, lowram, etc) manually.

2. xvesa doesn't seem to work. xfbdev works fine EXCEPT i'm stuck in 8 bit depth (again, no control over kernel arguments)

i'd love it if someone can help me out with

1. how to change root partition and still being able to run init
2. what's wrong with the xvesa? i keep getting cryptic 'interrupt pointer doesn't point to rom'. the full xfree86 with vesa driver works as evidenced by linux2200 distro so it must be something specific to tinyx.

Posted by thedevil on Oct. 22 2005,15:23

progress report....

1. i still have no other way around chroot but life with no init isn't all that bad so i'll leave it as it is for now.
2. correction, vesa driver of the full xfree DOESNOT work. i tried this with 4.3.0 and it crashed with 'no v_bios' which i take it to mean it couldn't find the video bios in the expected memory address. i got it to work at 16 bit depth by replacing the tinyx with the (almost) full xfree. cyrix driver works -- with some bugs. (upon exiting x, the kernel framebuffer is all messed up resulting in unusable text console. and the only way i can make it fit under 50mb is by sacrificing firefox -- i'll probably put it back in as it might fit the 64mb cf with some other stuff taken out.

Posted by nilux on Oct. 25 2005,13:31

THEDEVIL

How are you supplying the kernel (if you are not using a flash card)?
Are you using DHCP , if yes then how are you getting to the init file (which must be somewhere )?

Also have u compiled ur own kernel ?
Please explain ..

Thanks in advance

Posted by Daniel on Oct. 28 2005,08:05

I'm still reading this forum, but till now I didn't find answers to few questions:
1. Have anybody installed on the linux2200, Firefox browser?
2. How can I install the SSH aplication?
3. How can I use the Netvista 2200 to access/work on a Windows XP PC (or any other Linux version PC) ?!?

Thanks in advance!

Posted by Daniel on Oct. 28 2005,08:27

Me again, with a question for 8363.
In fact, what's the trick with linux2200?!?
What has different from a standard linux, and why can't I install (let's say) Vector linux on CF ?
Thanks!

Posted by 8363 on Oct. 31 2005,08:28

look here:
< http://damnsmalllinux.org/cgi-bin....;t=3204 >

Posted by thedevil on Nov. 03 2005,10:40

Quote (nilux @ Oct. 25 2005,09:31)

if you don't have a cf card you can use nfs or tftp to supply the kernel. nfs works better for me 'coz i have to use nfs root anyway.

when you setup the n2200 bios to look for the kernel on an nfs server the bios connects to the nfs server, loads the pretected mode kernel into memory, sets up boot prompt arguments such as the nfsroot related arguments and starts the kernel. the kernel then takes care of the rest (including finding /etc/init, /sbin/init and executes them)

dhcp is an option but static ip can also be used. if dhcp is used you can just restrict the dhcp reply to contain just the ip info and use the kernel location saved in the bios. in case of nfsroot (regardless of how ip setting is obtained) the parent directory of the nfs share where the kernel is will be used for root fs and that's where the kernel will look for /etc/init and /sbin/init.

yes, i did compile the kernel so that i could include the cloop driver required by dsl. i used the 2.4.26 stock with only one patch to disable keyboard controller check (n2200 doesn't have one) you don't have to patch it but the kernel will complain about the missing controller and spend some time looking for it.

Posted by thedevil on Nov. 03 2005,10:52

Quote (Guest @ Oct. 28 2005,04:05)

dsl 1.5 includes firefox but you'll have to hack it to work with n2200 (it requires new kernel+modules or just the uncompressed version of the kernel distributed with dsl -- if someone manage to remove the boot+setup parts and uncompress the protected-mode code)

linux2200 8363 made doesn't come with firefox but if you have enough storage you can always add it. there's a detailed instruction somewhere but basically you just need to copy the program, the library, AND the shared library required by the program and its library. since the distribution is taken from a debian woody it's easier to satisfy library dependency if you get the program from a woody repository as well.

ssh is included but incomplete (it doesn't have scp and sftp but you can just copy the programs themselves 'coz all the required libraries are there)

to use the box as a window thin-client you can use rdesktop. it's not included but i think someone has already packaged it. vnc is another solution but you'll have to run vncserver on the window box.

Posted by thedevil on Nov. 03 2005,11:00

my next project is actually to hack grub to work with n2200. basically, you have to write an elf code that looks like a kernel (same entry point and so on) which will load grub's 2nd stage loader which, in turn, shows the menu and loads the real kernel. this way, hacking other distro (including dsl) to work with n2200 would be a lot easier since you can use initrd and any kernel argument you want.

i'm a bit rusty on assambly and rather busy with my thesis at the moment but when i have the time to do it i'll post the result here.

Posted by thedevil on Nov. 03 2005,11:15

Quote (Guest @ Nov. 03 2005,05:40)

in case of nfsroot (regardless of how ip setting is obtained) the parent directory of the nfs share where the kernel is will be used for root fs and that's where the kernel will look for /etc/init and /sbin/init.

sorry, i'm not registered so i can't edit my post. what i meant there is the current directory. ie. the same directory where kernel is.

Posted by nilux on Nov. 04 2005,04:55

the devil..
thanks for your earlier response..

which BIOS ROM version are u using ? i cant find the nfsboot option on mine..

Also i am not able to run my own compiled kernel. Did u use gcc-2.95 to compile ur kernel (as earlier mentioned in the thread) ?
which compiler version did u use?

nilesh

Posted by thedevil on Nov. 04 2005,06:01

Quote (nilux @ Nov. 03 2005,23:55)

which BIOS ROM version are u using ? i cant find the nfsboot option on mine..

which compiler version did u use?

nilesh

the one in < this > file. i think it's BL072902 (07/29/02) -- i'm away from my n2200 so i can't confirm.

so when you say you can't choose nfs does that mean you're offered tftp as the only network booting option? the reason i asked is because my old bios (can't remember the version) supports both nfs and tftp boot protocol but it doesn't support linux kernel that's why i had to upgrade. regardless of bios version you should be able to change

1. boot source: network/flash
2. boot protocol: tftp/nfs
3. boot server: dhcp/nvram
4. thinclient: dhcp/nvram

i used network+nfs+nvram+nvram

as for the kernel, i used gcc-2.95 too. the file you need is the vmlinux in the top-most directory not the one in arch/i386/kernel/compressed or bImage or bzImage. what did the bios say? (assuming it can't start the kernel at all) if the kernel did start but failed then it's most likely the options you chose ie. no nfsroot support.

Posted by nilux on Nov. 06 2005,06:06

thanks, i am now able to use nfsroot.

what are the differences (in hardware) between N2200 and a PC?
why can't i use the root file system of my PC for the thin client?

Its currently not working with a redhat 7.2 root file system.. while spawning the 6 terminals ( /sbin/mingetty ), it gives error

INIT: Id "1" respawning too fast: disabled for 5 minutes

Init is also not able to find /dev/tty0 and /dev/mouse.
How is the 8363's rootfs working ?

please clarify

Posted by thedevil on Nov. 06 2005,06:20

some of the important difference are

- n2200 doesn't have keyboard controller (hence no /dev/psaux where /dev/mouse usually points to -- you have to re-link /dev/mouse to /dev/input/mice for usb mouse instead)
- n2200 doesn't have rtc (you'll have to run ntp client to update the time from a time server every time you restart)

8363's linux2200 doesn't run init+getty. you're always root with only 1 console (no virtual terminal)

Posted by jyrts on Nov. 26 2005,00:08

i'm waiting for the "grub hack" - thats all I need.
There are two ways to run all kind of linux distros with the
N2200... one is to hack the bios to support initrd(linuxbios?), the other one is to hack grub... and thedevil, if you really
make it work - i can't thank you enough...

Posted by mookie on Nov. 27 2005,02:08

Check out the internet appliance bbs at
< http://www.linux-hacker.net/cgi-bin/UltraBoard/UltraBoard.pl >

They have a lot of gadgets like that on this site. I was going to try and boot my Gateway Connected Touchpad which is a similar gadget to the IBM Netvista but the Gateway has a touchscreen.

Posted by trialex on Nov. 30 2005,22:07

Has anyone tried installing VLC to stream media off a network?

Posted by beginner on Jan. 09 2006,14:05

i'm waiting for the "grub hack" too.
I want to get < www.thinstation.org > on a n2200.

Posted by hiltec on Mar. 01 2006,10:10

i stopped trying to install DSL on a Netvista 2200 TC ... now i'm using a NCD ThinSTAR 564.NET ... it works fine ....

for some pic's go to ==> www.hiltec.at

Posted by grossjo on May 15 2006,10:23

Quote (Guest @ Oct. 17 2005,04:26)

ok, back to the original topic. dsl on n2200.

i managed to get dsl started on n2200 using nfsroot (don't have any cf card lying around). 2 problems so far.

@ thedevil,

i am using linux2200.0.2.1. booting off a CF-Card. As i am missing some apps i would like to have DSL itself work. Did you make any progress?

Regards;
Joachim@grossjo.de

Posted by jyrts on May 29 2006,13:36

I use the Netvista N2200 WBT. They have only a 16MB flash. Soo I used the original flash for kernel&root and an extra USB flash for /usr/ - everything works as it should. Theoretically you can even use a 4GB USB flash or an 1TB USB harddrive :cool:

Rightnow I'm building an mini firewall distribution with traffic shaping and all that kind of stuff - too bad, that the N2200 supports only upto 256MB+32MB RAM(for SQUID web cache)

The < http://packages.debian.org/oldstable > is very usefull(top, mc, iptables, mpg123 and etc.) :blues:

Posted by DavidSFN on June 12 2006,14:16

Okay I am at a total loss as to where to ask this. I have been playing with linux2200 for days now and no matter what I do it always fails to load X. All I get is tux with a flashing dot under it. If I try to startx from the busybox terminals I get complaints of missing libraries. I have built on both versions 0.1 and 0.2.1. Many times, I also once put links in for the missing libraries only to be told there was no variables for startX and fluxbox had no server to connect to.

I have been doing all my transferring from a ubuntu liveCD as root (hard to actually get those liveCDs to work properly in root)

Has anyone else seen this problem or is there something obvious I am missing? I would appreciate even a single word of help as I am totally stuck.

Posted by deryk on July 04 2006,23:39

ok, so I have a IBM 2200 thin client too.

I bought it long before I read any of these posts with the same brainy idea as all of you must have had. I figured install DSL onto my 128mb CF (what I had laying around) and slip it into the cf slot on the thin client and like magic it would work.

As we have all learned that was apparently not the case.

I have gotten (finally) the so-called "linux-2200" installed on the CF and the machine will boot from it.

However, the problem is there isn't much a person can do with that OS.

I love DSL and it has a lot of great programs, is there anyway possible that this can work for me to slip DSL on the same CF card and some how get into it through linux-2200 once it's booted? Or is there some magic way one of you wizards have gotten this figured out?

Any advice is greatly appreciated!

PS, one of the programs in particular I need to run is SAMBA (in order to play music files from my server). AMSN would be nice too.

Posted by ans on Feb. 02 2007,22:56

i just bought two 8363-EXX from ebay, updated the firmware to the current version and tried to run linux-2200.
the one that has cyrix printed on its chips works fine.
after the firmware update it booted straight into linux. i already tried to boot linux from cf before the update, i guess it just kept the old settings in nvram.
the other one is an older national semiconductor labeled version. updating from cf worked fine. for some reason however it won't boot from cf. it says something like "no flash card detected."
also i cannot change the boot file path in the setup menu, when i hit enter in the main menu the option disappears.
i'm using only one cf card here, so the card is fine. the firmware versions are the same. the hardware should be identical. updating from cf worked flawlessly. wtf!!#§$

Posted by TubbyTommy on May 16 2007,12:59

All,

For those who have been waiting for Kernel 2.6 on the N2200-8363, then I'm pleased to announce - progress has been made!

< http://sourceforge.net/projects/linux2200-26/ >

There is no patch, as of yet, but that should be forthcoming. Now you can use all those lovely k2.6 apps you've been waiting to be back-ported!

TT.

Posted by starkeeper on Oct. 25 2007,07:20

Hi,
I try to make my own kernel for the 8363. But this seems to be more tricky than some people want to admit. I can load my kernel from CF or via TFTP. The Firmware is loading the image, but after that the thinclient powers of.

I tried differrent kernel version and different gcc versions too. But i had no success. Sometimes when I compile with gcc-4.x the firmware says, that it loads teh kernel software but the screen doesn't change at all.

The ready made kernels for that piece of hardware are running fine. So what is wrong with my own kernels?

greets starkeeper