How to boot DSL using grub - frugal?

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[CNK]

@james c
As he is using a SATA HDD, the device is named "sda", even in DSL.


The hash (#) on the kernel line won't stop the following commands, that only works at the beginning of a new line. You will have to delete the unneeded commands (you can always save a copy of your last menu.lst).

Your "KNOPPIX" cloop file and its directory are in the standard place, so with the kernel command "root=/dev/sda2/dsl", you shouldn't need "knoppix_dir=" and "knoppix_name=". That's assuming DSL doesn't mind running in your "dsl" directory.

You would have got the "ide1" command from the DSL WIki Boot Commands page. (http://www.damnsmalllinux.org/wiki/cheat_codes.html#Other_boot_labels)

What is the error you receive with the GRUB entry I suggested in my last post?

[james c]

@james c
As he is using a SATA HDD, the device is named "sda", even in DSL.

Thanks for letting me know that my DSL installs,which do happen to be on SATA drives, are not supposed to be booting.Now I need to break the bad news to my computers......

Good luck to you Benny.

[CNK]

Presumably you've got your BIOS set to make SATA emulate IDE HDDs. I've run DSL on at least a couple of SATA systems (in one case to reformat a bunch of SATA HDDs, so I got used to the device names) and they always get named as "sd".

[Benny]

Thanks for replying, CNK & james c!

I've failed to check out that BIOS emulation thing but I'll do at next boot. I'm glad you clarify the # usage at a grub line, I wasn't sure that it was going to work but decided to try it out in the open in hope if it wasn't used correctly someone like you would state so.

Before trying the latest changes to the menu.lst file but with the expression after the '#' still present there I received the error message: cannot find knoppix... or something very much like that.

If this fail again I've thought of examine all the possibilities, one by one, until something different happens. I'm talking about of taking each grub entry line, see what might be brought in that's new, try it until I've to jump to the next line; repeating the process all over again until all the possibilities are exausted. But for now I'm glad that I've both of you to follow...

[CNK]

Just a thought (that should really have occoured before), what file system is on your sda2 partition? ext2 and ext3 should be supported by DSL, but some other ones aren't.

If you don't know, the best way to check (as fdisk lists all Linux file systems as type "Linux") is to boot Puppy, open a terminal and type "mount". One of the lines listed should start with "/dev/sda2" and further along that line, after the word "type" your file system should be stated.

EDIT: Whoops, seems I didn't ask that before because you already mentioned it was ext3. Oh well.

[Benny]

Thanks CNK! I think I should re-state, this time correctly, what the message I receive after booting dsl is: "Can't find knoppix filesystem".

After the process is complete & I'm facing that limited console, am I looking/using a limited dsl OS or this's something grub gives me as 'something to work with'? I think if it's the former then grub indeed found dsl's folder, if not then I've been confused & wrong all the time...

[CNK]

That minimal console is the kernel on its own. Most of what makes Linux is additional software that is loaded by the kernel and your kernel can't find its files to load, so all it can give you is the basic system of built-in tools used for initial loading.

In relation to the bootloader, this means that GRUB has loaded the kernel and killed itself (that's a good thing, I coudn't think of another way to put it). The problem is that the commands passed to the kernel by GRUB (reading from the "kernel" line in menu.lst, hence why I've been talking about it so much) are not being properly understood or executed thereafter. In other words the kernel can't find its files (which are in "/dsl") based on the instructions you are giving it in the "kernel" line of menu.lst.

I can think of three potential causes for this in your case:
1. Your commands in the "kernel" line are incorrect.
2. The DSL kernel can't load its files from inside a sub-directory on a partition (your "/dsl" folder).
3. The kernel can't read data on the sda2 partition (eg. due to hardware incompatibility, data corruption or use of an unsupported file system).

Unless we are both missing something major and specific to your circumstance, then the kernel lines suggested by the Wiki, "james c" and myself should be correct, which makes no. 1 less likely.

If you can boot DSL from a CD etc. (with the "sata" boot code) and read the "/dsl" folder of the sda2 partition, then it is less likely that cause no. 3 is the problem. However it could perhaps be a problem that occours only at the early boot process.

Therefore I'm afraid that cause no. 2 seems rather likely. It would be worth doing some in-depth searching with Google for people who have tried booting the 2.4 kernel in a sub-directory of a partition, in case it was a known problem that was fixed in later kernels (such as the one used by Puppy).

[Benny]

Thanks for replying CNK! Specially interesting is what you state in relation to that limited console.

I'm about to test something now so I'll edit this post later to complete it.

Edit: I decided to make some basic changes to my approach. I already shrank my Ist partition to 8 GB with the intention of putting in there DSL only (still ntfs). While reading a wiki on this they were using loadlin as a loader & a FAT32 fs & including dos there. By my part, it made me think of including at that partition, if at all advisable/possible, freedos. This last possibility restricts the possible fss that can be used there; which brings me back to what is more important to me right now: what fs is better for booting up DSL frugally? If it can hold freedos, better.

[CNK]

Yep, FreeDOS with FAT32 should work and I think almost certainly in a sub-directory (have done such a thing myself with another Linux distro). Might be a good way to go.

[Benny]

After having read some info at some web pages I decided to format that partition as ext2 because it was advisable for DSL. I already have there the necessary files/folders & re-configured the menu.lst file to fit these other circumstances. After booting up I ended with a "limited console only", again...

My DSL section from the grub config file is shown below:

"# 7) Linux bootable partition config begins
  title Damn Small Linux 4.4
#  frugal in sda2 dir dsl
  root (hd0,0)
#  rootnoverify (hd0,1)
  kernel /isolinux/linux24 root=/sda1/isolinux/dsl knoppix_dir=/KNOPPIX knoppix_name=KNOPPIX
#  kernel /dsl/linux24 root=/dev/sda2/dsl knoppix_dir=/dsl/KNOPPIX knoppix_name=KNOPPIX frugal sata
  initrd /isolinux/minirt24.gz
  makeactive
  boot
# Linux bootable partition config ends"

I also tried it after editing at boot time, with the following cut: /sda1 at the kernel line & at the 'root' entry with the same results.

I'm out of ideas now... Could things be different if I format the partition as FAT32? What if I just put the iso as it's right there only, because I've read somewhere that both, DSL can be booted up from the iso file as well as that grub can boot an iso image?

Apart from the above, and before doing anything as mentioned there, is there something you can see that could be tweaked at the menu.lst file?

Thanks CNK for your follow up with this!

[Benny]

I found near the iso file I'm using for booting DSL that I had another DSL iso ending with initrd in its name. Its' version is 1 or 2 steps behind the one I'm trying to boot now. I put it besides the other one but I think that just been sitting there won't make any diference. Nevertheless, I can extract its' contents and substitute the present one with this, that's if you think it might help on this. What do you say?

Also, is it too diferent/dificult to boot from the iso file directly? I've read that it can be done. Do you think that's a good second choice? Maybe first choice?

Thanks for any tips on this.

[CNK]

So you're installing DSL in its own partition now? No more trying to make it live in harmony on the same partition as Puppy in a directory named "dsl"? Well in that case your task should be a lot easier.

Move everything from your "dsl" folder to the root directory of the sda1 partition, you might want to put "linux24" and "minirt24.gz" into a folder named "boot" so you can follow the norm. Make sure the the KNOPPIX folder is in the root directory with the KNOPPIX file inside it.

Now if your DSL partition is at sda1 and you have put the "linux24" and "minirt24.gz" files in the "/boot" directory, then the following menu.lst entry should boot DSL:

Code:

title Damn Small Linux frugal in sda1
  root (hd0,0)
  kernel /boot/linux24 root=/dev/sda1 frugal sata
  initrd /boot/minirt24.gz
  makeactive
  boot

If you want to boot the iso then perhaps the "fromhd" boot command might work, but it is probably only for booting from a CD (then loading an image from the HDD).

For the record, ext3 is backwards compatible with ext2, so even if DSL didn't support ext3 (which I believe it does), it should still work fine running it as an ext2 partition without need to reformat. FAT32 is definately not preferred for booting DSL and I don't know if it works at all (I may assume not).

What was wrong with booting using LoadLin, if you still want to run in the "dsl" directory on sda2?

[Benny]

Thanks for the info CNK! I already made the changes to menu.lst you mentioned. Now all that's needed is to reboot & try it...

In relation to your last paragraph I'm afraid I don't understand it. I mentioned loadlin just because I've read about it & DSL is a linux OS & because it might have some other tricks for making DSL boot on my hardware. Did I understood your point correct? Not that I'm about to start that route now; still not finished with my grub trials.

[CNK]

I thought you meant that you were going to install FreeDOS and use that to boot DSL using LoadLin. That would work better if you really want DSL on the same partition as everything else. However if that isn't especially important, then go ahead and install DSL in its own partition (sda1), as I said before it makes things a lot simpler.

[Benny]

Thanks very much for your support CNK!

 Now that I introduced the last changes as you mentioned above finally DSL booted up normally. I liked the desktop it shows very much, as well as the group of icons on the it. I haven't tried it fully yet & didn't make a backup, I tried it but failed to put the info it required there because I was in a hurry & had to go. Today, I'm going to try again with more calm.

I don't know if I'm going to encounter more issues in relation to DSL but if I do, do you think is better to start another thread for it/them? How should I mark this issue as SOLVED? By adding the word SOLVED to the Subject line?

Thanks again, CNK, for your great help!